What the hell happened to this comic

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What the hell happened to this comic

Postby skull man » Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:53 pm

Why has it taken a year for NOTHING to happen in the story? One battle, in which Parson's done nothing, tedious characters (Wanda and Jillian) talked for weeks, and an uninsipired Deus ex Machina. Compare this to issue one, which covered an entire war campaign!

What the hell, erfworld? Exercise your plot muscles!
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby ftl » Wed Jul 28, 2010 8:48 pm

Are you talking since the end of TBfGK? Since then, Jillian and Don refounded FAQ, Slately restarted RCCII, GK's led a campaign and took down Unaroyal. That was basically what happened over the summer updates. Issue 1 of Book 2 was the first part of the battle for Jetstone, in which GK went from dominant to underdog.

There have been far more turns that have passed since the end of TBfGK than passed during TBfGK :)
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby spriteless » Wed Jul 28, 2010 9:30 pm

And one has passed since the start of the comic proper.
T'was a splendidly speedy defection.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby Tensor » Wed Aug 04, 2010 8:55 am

I am in the same boat with TC, but not so much as things not happening in the story, as things just aren't happening much at all. Here's the timeline since the latest book started, this was after the "time off" also mind you.

Book 2 – Text Updates 028 - 7/29
6 days
Book 2 – Page 37 - 7/23
7 days
Book 2 – Text Updates 027 - 7/16
8 days
Book 2 – Page 36 - 7/8
7 days
Book 2 – Text Updates 026 - 7/1
7 days
Book 2 – Page 35 - 6/24
8 days
Book 2 – Page 34 - 6/16
4 days
Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002 - 6/12 (imcomplete entry also)

What is with it being a week between updates which INCLUDES text updates. The time between actual page updates is even more dramatic.

Book 2 – Page 37 - 7/23
15 days
Book 2 – Page 36 - 7/8
14 days
Book 2 – Page 35 - 6/24
8 days
Book 2 – Page 34 - 6/16
4 days
Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002 - 6/12 (imcomplete entry also)

So instead of just complaining, I'll tell you what would make me happy - more text updates. I'm not talking text updates with the little artwork at the bottom, which I'm guessing is what delays even those, just simple text updates. I'll be honest, the pages are great, but they compliment the story more than tell the story. The depth can happen in the text updates without having to take forever to move the story along.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby the_tick_rules » Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:17 pm

I think things are going fine. we're about to get some good combat probably.
I would be a procrastinator, but I keep putting it off.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby gaiaswill » Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:24 pm

I'm thinking there's selective memory at work here. Book 1 took quite a while, with bouts of no updates at all. This was before the invention of the text update, so at least now we get a weekly fix. Also, Book 2 is deliberately split into more distinct chapters, probably because it was rather annoying to reference arcs in the unchaptered Book 1.

At the time, Book 1 also felt much less epic at 2-4 pages a month. The pacing is pretty comparable.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby raphfrk » Tue Aug 10, 2010 7:11 pm

Tensor wrote:What is with it being a week between updates which INCLUDES text updates. The time between actual page updates is even more dramatic.


The problem with this is that Erf physiologically shifts, so that it is surprising when it updates, rather than looking forward to it.

October: 2 (start)
November: 7
Switched to new page every 5 days
December: 5
January: 4
February: 4
March: 4
April: 4
May: 3
June: 2 + (2 klogs)
July: 2

The updates were pretty consistent to one per week for a few months. With any luck, the slower rate is just a temporary situation.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby Hiai » Sun Aug 15, 2010 12:39 am

skull man wrote:Why has it taken a year for NOTHING to happen in the story? One battle, in which Parson's done nothing, tedious characters (Wanda and Jillian) talked for weeks, and an uninsipired Deus ex Machina. Compare this to issue one, which covered an entire war campaign!

What the hell, erfworld? Exercise your plot muscles!



Plot Armour, is that you?!?!!?!?!

Personally, I like the depth of character development we are seeing and am enjoying the complexity and flavor of the delicious concoction called Erfworld. If it's not fast and meaty enough for you, perhaps a drive-thru cheeseburger is more your style than the perfectly seared and seasoned Filet Mignon that Rob and Xin serve up here.

Me, I like both, and so I read all kinds of things, and refrain from complaining to the cook when the food I ordered is exactly what it should be, rather than the meal I had around the corner last night.

And by the way, perhaps you should Google Deus ex Machina. I do not think it means what you think it means.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby Ansan Gotti » Mon Aug 16, 2010 1:43 pm

Hiai wrote:
skull man wrote:Why has it taken a year for NOTHING to happen in the story? One battle, in which Parson's done nothing, tedious characters (Wanda and Jillian) talked for weeks, and an uninsipired Deus ex Machina. Compare this to issue one, which covered an entire war campaign!

What the hell, erfworld? Exercise your plot muscles!



Plot Armour, is that you?!?!!?!?!


You know what, that is actually an interesting comment. PlotArmour was banned on January 30. Skull Man registered on February 19.

Speculation IS what we do here, right? ;)
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby Tensor » Wed Aug 18, 2010 12:00 pm

raphfrk wrote:The problem with this is that Erf physiologically shifts, so that it is surprising when it updates, rather than looking forward to it.


This is an excellent point. This wonderful comic I'm supporting is becoming a crap shoot and an "it's about time" as opposed to "it's Saturday, sweet, I get to go check out the new Erfworld" experience.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby Mal » Tue Aug 24, 2010 7:02 am

I remember waaaaay back when we were in book one on Giant in the Playground, and just after a news post that Jamie was getting married, the update schedule sorta went *poof* There were times when we'd get one page in the entire month. it didn't really gain any steam again until the last chunk of pages, the last month of which we got 5 updates, and it felt astounding.

So we're lagging behind now. We still have text updates, and Rob's been dealing with other projects as well. It'll get better. It always does.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby the_tick_rules » Tue Aug 24, 2010 11:41 pm

Or occupy your time with other stuff while you wait.
I would be a procrastinator, but I keep putting it off.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby Tensor » Wed Aug 25, 2010 2:32 pm

Mal wrote:We still have text updates


No, you're wrong, we don't still have text updates, at least not in the context you suppose - as snacks while we wait for the meat. We've been in a pattern of getting one update a week, text or otherwise, the last few months. Text updates, which began as the "snacks," have evolved to become the new meat.

Text updates would alleviate a lot of problems here, even if it's just filling in some more details or background or whatever. Is it really that hard to stick to a schedule? Rob, get some stuff in the hopper so you can release on a reliable schedule even if things come up. We can have text updates without the art too, so that's an option. This "update whenever" attitude is really what irks me, and I consider myself a big fan.

As a comparison, let me c/c against Penny Arcade. I don't particularly care for it all that much, as they overuse the thesaurus just to sound cool, but at least they put out something three times a week. Yes that's their full time job, yes their content is provided more by current events than their creativity, but here's the thing, they have a schedule and they stick to it. Just make Erf's schedule "Every Saturday morning" if you have to, at least it'd be something to look forward to. It's tiring old coming back seeing the same page up for a week or more, and seeing the threads reach 20+ pages just because there's a vacuum of plot development.

Sorry for the rant, but I'm a tool, I've bought the right to do so in a reasonable manner if nothing else.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby Radagast » Wed Aug 25, 2010 8:59 pm

I would personally love to see a regular update schedule - even if it's a slow one! That way at least I'm not constantly checking the site and being disappointed to see the same page up.

Something like "Every Saturday morning" or something like that, once a week, at least until you can build up a few extras in advance, and then you can go to twice a week or whatever works, but always having a few in advance so if you hit a busy time there are still updates ready to go up.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby the_tick_rules » Sun Aug 29, 2010 10:52 pm

That would be nice, but you can't always get what you want, but if you try real hard, you just might find...
I would be a procrastinator, but I keep putting it off.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby Tensor » Mon Aug 30, 2010 8:17 am

the_tick_rules wrote:That would be nice, but you can't always get what you want, but if you try real hard, you just might find...


Sorry, how was this post constructive? It's really simple. If you don't ask, it's a guaranteed no. Plus there's more than simple asking happening here, there are reasonable alternatives and productive suggestions appearing.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby Hiai » Mon Aug 30, 2010 9:49 pm

Tensor wrote:
the_tick_rules wrote:That would be nice, but you can't always get what you want, but if you try real hard, you just might find...


Sorry, how was this post constructive? It's really simple. If you don't ask, it's a guaranteed no. Plus there's more than simple asking happening here, there are reasonable alternatives and productive suggestions appearing.



I'm sorry, but how was your post constructive? We have already been informed of the reasons for irregular updates, told that there are target goals for timing, and informed that current events not entirely under the author's control are interfering with the reaching of those goals. How does griping that those goals aren't actually being met help or add to the discussion? I mean, they already pointed out they weren't being met, before you ever chimed in, and that they are doing everything they can to change that. What your remarks in this thread all boil down to is "I don't care what else is going on, I want what I want, and if you can't do that, than give me some sloppy sh*t to look at as filler 'til some real stuff is ready". I see no point at all in which there are "productive suggestions" that are actually viable to these particular authors being offered. I do, however, see alot of bellyaching and sniping at others. The thread title in and of itself is excessively provocative, which is why I voiced my suspicion that it was very "PlotArmour"-like.

Truth is, webcomics are notoriously hard to pin down as to schedules. Even the most regularly updated comic will occasionaly get derailed by such things as say...Hurricane Katrina. Life happens, and as good as it is, it's just a webcomic. Having interrmittant updates bothers the authors far, far more than it does you, I assure you. If there were truly any constructive advice being given here, I'd imagine they would be all over it and gushing their thankfulness for the "solution" they had been looking for. Unfortunately, it's yet another gripe thread started by a whiner and perpetuated by a bunch more whiners.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby Tensor » Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:02 pm

Hiai wrote:Unfortunately, it's yet another gripe thread started by a whiner and perpetuated by a bunch more whiners.


Amazing how you can boil down people's efforts into such a compartmentalized category. How rude is that?
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby raphfrk » Tue Aug 31, 2010 6:17 am

Hiai wrote:Truth is, webcomics are notoriously hard to pin down as to schedules. Even the most regularly updated comic will occasionaly get derailed by such things as say...Hurricane Katrina.


Many of them also have a regular schedule. Also, this comic is not an amateur operation run by a single person, in their spare time. It is being run with a subscriptions based business model (plus selling comics).

Speaking personally, I am not sure if I will renew after the 12 months run out. This is a combination of the slow updates and the fact that the hi-res images don't give any boost to the experience, due to how they are presented. I didn't subscribe to get access to them, but I think it shows the lack of commitment to subscribers. While I recognise the importance of new readers, subscribers also matter at least as much.

The (potential) advantage of the hi-res images is that when you are reading the comic you see a little more detail. If it takes 5 additional clicks to get from the main page to the hi-res image, then it is barely worth the trouble. Also, the last page posted to the high-res archive is page 36. The low res version of that page was posted on July 8th and so is 8 weeks delayed. It is essentially impossible to read the comic in high-res. It is purely for re-read purposes.

My view has been that I would rather they spend their time making new comics rather than dealing with the hi-res archive. However, August is now the 3rd month with only 2 updates, so it looks like that isn't happening anyway.

Subscribers only subscribe because they want to support the author/artist. It's not like any one subscriber will make or break the project. Logically, each (potential) subscriber should make the same calculation and so nobody subscribes. However, that is not what happens, people are willing to donate. The first thing that a new subscriber sees is the hi-res archive, which gives the impression that while they support the creators, the feeling is not mutual.

Also, I also don't understand why it is so hard to make the hi-res stuff available. Presumably, Xin generates (very) hi-res images and then all the other versions can be automatically generated from that using software. It really just says that they don't care about subscribers.
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Re: What the hell happened to this comic

Postby zilfallon » Tue Aug 31, 2010 8:15 am

well, slow updates never bothered me much, until i saw another comic getting updated, daily. (another comic of the same author, actually)
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