Decrypting friendlies?

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Decrypting friendlies?

Postby Walter » Wed Oct 14, 2009 3:48 pm

When Jack and Parson are talking and preparing for battle simulation, it's mentioned that they pass the decrypted hobgobwin knights without a word.

That got me thinking. If the Hobgobwins are decrypted, are they decrypted because they are returnees from the original siege/catastrophe, or did they pop more recently and get executed? We know that the GK forces are killing and decrypting everyone they concur, seems odd that they'd behave differently towards their own. More to the point, there are substantial benefits to not doing so.

It seems like you'd want to execute and decrypt every unit that popped in GK, on the basis that they become maintenance free, and can get stack bonuses from Wanda. From our view into Ansom's POV it seems like it also increases their Loyalty. From an IC POV it seems like the GK side should decrypt everything, or at least everything Wanda has Move to reach (everything with a Dwagon relay).

I think Parson is genre savvy enough to know that you don't want all your troops to share the same vulnerability to plot screwage, but Wanda/Ansom seem like about the right blend of stupid and smart to institute a mandatory decrypting policy.

And that brings up another point, why not decrypt the casters? We know from Ansom that even powerful units can be decrypted, and retain their usefulness. Shouldn't Wanda get working on Jack, Maggie, etc? It would seem that insuring their loyalty and getting rid of their expensive maintenance would be critical.

Parson himself seems enough of a rules exception that Wanda would be leery of trying it with him. He's too valuable to mess with.

I could easily see a scene in the future with Parson arguing with Wanda in front of Stanley about the fate of GK's non decrypted.

Edit: Looking back at the Mistey's funeral scene, Uncroaked casters only function as infantry. If the same is true of decrypted, then that'll save Jack & Maggie, for sure. Wanda & Stanley may not care to experiment.
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Re: Decrypting friendlies?

Postby gaiaswill » Wed Oct 14, 2009 4:14 pm

Not seeing it. As it is now, living units are allowed to die once and use Decryption as a get-out-of-death-free card. I see no reason why you would kill a perfectly capable unit just for the upkeep and combat benefit; the capability of being "resurrected" is far better. If you really wanted to be this ruthless (remember, these are people you are talking about), you would at least put these living units at the front line so they could die "legit" first, then Decrypt for extra mileage.
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Re: Decrypting friendlies?

Postby raphfrk » Wed Oct 14, 2009 4:52 pm

gaiaswill wrote:Not seeing it. As it is now, living units are allowed to die once and use Decryption as a get-out-of-death-free card. I see no reason why you would kill a perfectly capable unit just for the upkeep and combat benefit; the capability of being "resurrected" is far better. If you really wanted to be this ruthless (remember, these are people you are talking about), you would at least put these living units at the front line so they could die "legit" first, then Decrypt for extra mileage.


Right. Assuming the units are loyal, there is no point in killing them. Units are presumably worth their upkeep anyway, otherwise, there would be no point in popping them.

Also, even if loyalty isn't an issue, Stanley could still be concerned about who the unit is loyal to.

If you attack a city with a decrypted force and lose 500 units, they are gone for good. However, if 250 of those units were normal units, then you only lose 250 units.

The decryption just gives all your units a "free life" and there is no point in wasting it.
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Re: Decrypting friendlies?

Postby SteveMB » Wed Oct 14, 2009 5:10 pm

raphfrk wrote:Assuming the units are loyal, there is no point in killing them. Units are presumably worth their upkeep anyway, otherwise, there would be no point in popping them.

Especially when Stanley's side is rolling in money from the gems brought up by the volcano and their wave of conquest.
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Re: Decrypting friendlies?

Postby Walter » Thu Oct 15, 2009 1:46 pm

Fair enough, good points.
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Re: Decrypting friendlies?

Postby Silophant » Tue Oct 20, 2009 10:57 pm

That being said, since there's no real chance of putting Parson into battle, and his upkeep is really, really high, it may be worth it in his case.

Yes, I realize that the main conflict of the next book is likely to be Parson v. Wanda, and that won't work if he's her mindslave. I also realize there's no guarantee Parson can be decrypted.
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Re: Decrypting friendlies?

Postby Prometheus » Tue Oct 20, 2009 11:10 pm

And like raphfrk said, Stanley probably wouldn't want his entire army to be purely loyal to Wanda and not him.
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Re: Decrypting friendlies?

Postby taltamir » Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:12 am

Silophant wrote:That being said, since there's no real chance of putting Parson into battle, and his upkeep is really, really high, it may be worth it in his case.

Yes, I realize that the main conflict of the next book is likely to be Parson v. Wanda, and that won't work if he's her mindslave. I also realize there's no guarantee Parson can be decrypted.

he isn't THAT expensive. 1000 a day... the spell to get him was several hundreds times that...

And they supposedly got so many gems from the mountain, as to be, possibly the richest side in the world. So decrypting parson, or casters, or even infantry just to avoid paying the bills makes no sense... now if they were running out of money, then instead of losing units due to lack of funds, just kill and decrypt them all. And send living troops in first, so that those who die can be decrypted... saving the decrypted as a reserve since they cannot be redecrypted.
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Re: Decrypting friendlies?

Postby Lord Kasavin » Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:47 am

taltamir wrote:
Silophant wrote:That being said, since there's no real chance of putting Parson into battle, and his upkeep is really, really high, it may be worth it in his case.

Yes, I realize that the main conflict of the next book is likely to be Parson v. Wanda, and that won't work if he's her mindslave. I also realize there's no guarantee Parson can be decrypted.

he isn't THAT expensive. 1000 a day... the spell to get him was several hundreds times that...

And they supposedly got so many gems from the mountain, as to be, possibly the richest side in the world. So decrypting parson, or casters, or even infantry just to avoid paying the bills makes no sense... now if they were running out of money, then instead of losing units due to lack of funds, just kill and decrypt them all. And send living troops in first, so that those who die can be decrypted... saving the decrypted as a reserve since they cannot be redecrypted.


Great analysis. Good thing GK is led by a such a thoughtful and erudite... Nevermind.

Stanley would so arange for Parson to die on the front lines to save a 1,000 schmuckers a turn. Plus, Parson's penchant for insulting him would probably go away and I don't think he trusts Parson an iota more than Wanda and probably a good deal less. There is no evidence that Wanda has ever ignored an order from Stanley.
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Re: Decrypting friendlies?

Postby moose o death » Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:03 am

i'm not sure what the usual is for games of the type. but the only game even remotely like erfworld i've played was balck and white 2.

to promote a citizen to a soldier, i think it cost 10 times as much food for that unit.

so to upgrade parson from garrison to even test if he has the move to leave the city.. could cost 10,000 schmuckers for the turn. it may be built into his spell that he can't be sent out to war.

under that circumstance parson would need most of GK forces to be routted and be heading for another BFGK storyline. also why would stanley risk the perfect warlord being loyal to wanda's arkentool? he's not QUITE that stupid
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