Book 2 – Text Updates 017

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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby Vreejack » Sat Mar 13, 2010 3:48 pm

SteveMB wrote:It is? Her declared goal is to unite the Arkentools -- conquering the world might be a useful means to that end, but not a necessary one.


Not strictly necessary, no, but it seems she is going to do it anyway. Conquering the vast majority of it probably is necessary unless all the other wielders step forth and turn to her side. I don't see Charlie or anyone else lining up to do just that, yet. And then there is the issue of what the unified arkentool wielders will do with their tools. "Bringing the Arkentools together is [only] the next step". Conquering the world at that point would be a doddel, one of those "exercises left for the reader" or the point at which you shut off the game because you have obviously won and there is no enjoyment left in playing. And while in a dramatic setting that is not necessarily true, it only hammers home how desperately the eventual underdogs will want to stop her now, before things get even worse. Until Wanda steps forth and loudly proclaims that she has no intention in conquering the world the rest of the world will assume that it is exactly what she is doing. The "one world side" is already the Magic Kingdom's boogeyman. It's obviously Charlie's as well.


Oh, another reason that Wanda will not turn to join Charlie...forgot to mention because it's the most obvious one...leaving one Arkentool user (Stanley) for another does not advance her goal of bringing them together. By burning bridges with Stanley it would actually hurt her goal.
So...Watashi wa mizugorō ga sukina koto o kiita, neh?
A Prediction is what would have happened had there been no Prediction. What is scary is that they are also what will happen in spite of the Prediction.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby Urf » Sat Mar 13, 2010 5:46 pm

I'm betting the stress in Charlie's voice is because he's got Parson on call waiting.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby Roupe » Sat Mar 13, 2010 6:08 pm

Charlie strikes me as a intelligent person, He is surely aware that Parson is that too. So they both would know that the other knows; that they working against them. Concealed hostility (cold war) is often preferred than a open conflict. Even in the situation of both parties aware & hostile. This allow a more friendly conversations, parley & exchange -and doesn't tarnish a future truce.

Its also good strategy, to not let the enemies know your alliances & when your assisting them. That way, they are more likely underestimate (or overestimate)the opposition & make mistakes.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby Flyer » Sat Mar 13, 2010 6:24 pm

Sunfall wrote:People keep suggesting that Charlie wants Wanda a great deal. I don't think this is true.


I would tend to agree with this... it'd be an interesting development if something did happen along the lines of a Wanda/Charlie merger - ArkenCorp?
But I find it unlikely that Charlie is hot to grab up Wanda right this second.... I overestimated Charlie's plan... my assumption was that Jillian leaving the area was part of a larger gambit he had planned. Retracing a few steps it looks like his more modest plan was to whack the GK flying force with his Faqan proxy in order to throw GK back a bit while working his way back into the royal graces and and still come out smelling like a rose to Parson when he next contacts him for another of their friendly little chats. But I'm thinking Parson might figure out Charlie's behind GK's premature EOT or at least suspect it, and Charlie doesn't seem to realize how suspicious Parson is of him.... And then there's the Jillianization of the plan opening him up for further exposure....

So - Jillian going after Ansom after rebelling against Wanda's control - reminds me so much of her accidental run in with the dragon hex over the lake... when she decided her love for Ansom was more important than her relationship with Wanda. On reflection, there are a couple of significant differences - this time she didn't engage - perhaps Wanda might take to heart what Jillian said about the parley being an honest effort. But it might be awhile before we find out anything more on that.... Also, she was on her way to rescue Ansom's "statuesque rear" then, but is she going to try to rescue him now? I don't know if Ansom can be turned or not. Maybe another one of Wanda's dolls is going to get broken... Remember what happened to princess Cruz - her mother found her an abomination... Jillian could be looking to go Ole Yeller on him - At least Leroy got his chicken....


Spoiler: show
ok - in the end the 4 arkentools and the rightful wielders are brought together with Parson (aka Leeloo in the 5th element) - there's a a massive linking together and poof - he wakes up in Kansas.. er Columbus.. oh wait, maybe he rules as a wise leader for many years before returning through the wardrobe?
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby SkipYo » Sat Mar 13, 2010 11:20 pm

I've been lurking around here a bit and I joined the forum just to add that I think the symbol of Charlescomm (without the wings) is next to the Jetstone livery and above the Faq and Decrypted liveries on the main page. Sorry if anyone's added this before!
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby Angband » Sat Mar 13, 2010 11:33 pm

Urf wrote:I'm betting the stress in Charlie's voice is because he's got Parson on call waiting.


That's my guess... the long pause would be Charlie asking Parson for one of his calculations: "What are the odds I could get Wanda to turn to my side?" in some fashion. I suspect the answer is that Charlie COULD get Wanda to turn, but it will require openly intervening with his archons AND having to defend wanda from attack by Jetstone, thus throwing Charlie into open warfare with both the RCCII *and* Gobwin Knob.

The stress would be from Charlie deciding that the Decrypted are so powerful that he has to go for it.

(And I think having "Call Waiting" on thinkagrams is a hilarious ability for the Arkendish to have.)
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby DoctorJest » Sat Mar 13, 2010 11:45 pm

Angband wrote:
Urf wrote:I'm betting the stress in Charlie's voice is because he's got Parson on call waiting.


That's my guess... the long pause would be Charlie asking Parson for one of his calculations: "What are the odds I could get Wanda to turn to my side?" in some fashion.


I don't think so, Charley was very dismissive of the info about Wanda, which didn't even come up until AFTER he had the long pause. I don't think Charley is terribly interested in Wanda at the moment. I think it's Parson letting Charley know he at least suspects Charley was behind the whole Kingworld deal (natch). Further, I think Parson called HIM which is why the long pause. So he's busy mentally fencing with Parson and Jillian is "blah blah turn Wanda blah blah" and Charley is "yeah, whatever, look I gotta go, I got another call on the line. I have to take this. We'll talk about that thing you said later, whatever it is."

Charley wanting to acquire Wanda and the Decrypted (and thus become a Side Unto Himself instead of a "contractor") would be very uncharacteristically direct of him. Further, Faq would technically be the ones turning Wanda. He's an ally of convenience with Faq right now, but he's by no means becoming a vassal.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby DoctorJest » Sat Mar 13, 2010 11:54 pm

Vreejack wrote:
SteveMB wrote:Oh, another reason that Wanda will not turn to join Charlie...forgot to mention because it's the most obvious one...leaving one Arkentool user (Stanley) for another does not advance her goal of bringing them together. By burning bridges with Stanley it would actually hurt her goal.


But you forget that Wanda doesn't believe she has to do anything special to unite the Arkentools, but rather that it's destiny that is uniting the tools. She's merely playing her "part" as she sees it, as it's been "ordained". Wanda is a determinist. So it doesn't matter if it's the Arkendish and the Arkenpliers or the Arkenpliers and the Arkenhammer, sooner or later all the tools WILL be united, and no one can STOP that. Not in her world view. She refuses to go against her destiny because she believes it would do no good.

If she could be convinced that there's a purpose in her turning sides that plays into her sense of destiny, she might do it... but she'd need some clear advantage to doing so.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby gazes_also » Sun Mar 14, 2010 12:07 am

My prediction was half right - I expected Charlie to make a call, but to Parson, not Jillian.
As has been suggested by others, keeping his involvement secret from GK is probably at least partly to limit Parson's ability to make accurate predictions.

Jillian asked for support to destroy GK's column WITH their Chief Warlord, assuming she's being honest with her ally, it looks like Ansom may not be her turn target after all.

The 'Prize' - is it the archenpliers or Wanda: I would guess the pliers, but if he could get Wanda too, well, that's good too.
Charlie's not to surprised at Jillian going off the script. Given her personality, Jillian probably had quite a bit if leeway in 'the plan' with certain objectives that had to be achieved, but free to improvise how to get there and Charlie backfilling from there.

Charlie's 'Agreements' appear to be very binding on his partners, Jillian couldn't tell Wanda about Charlie's involvement anymore than Parson could lie to him about a calculation.

Why is Charlie distracted and stressed?
a]He is compensating for Jillian leaving JS and trying to assemble a flying group to get the pliers which is tricky if he doesn't want to use Archons and tip his hands. - seems unlikely, he would have been more annoyed at Jillian
b]Something else he was planing just went pear-shaped - possible.
c]He just got a call from Parson who figured out he must have been behind it. Since Charlie can hack the eyebook at anytime, what if Parson was just to start addressing messages to Charlie, would he get them? The argument against it is Stanley would be pretty ticked at his tactical savant sneaking into the corner to use his eyebook.

Conclusion, haven't got a clue, looking forward to what happens next.

Side speculation, I'm not convinced that Charlie is worried about the decrypted Archons giving up his secrets. Field Archons don't know much about Charlie, his secrets are only know by his personal retinue of Male Archons - the Bosleys.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby Urf » Sun Mar 14, 2010 12:25 am

I don't think so, Charley was very dismissive of the info about Wanda, which didn't even come up until AFTER he had the long pause. I don't think Charley is terribly interested in Wanda at the moment. I think it's Parson letting Charley know he at least suspects Charley was behind the whole Kingworld deal (natch). Further, I think Parson called HIM which is why the long pause. So he's busy mentally fencing with Parson and Jillian is "blah blah turn Wanda blah blah" and Charley is "yeah, whatever, look I gotta go, I got another call on the line. I have to take this. We'll talk about that thing you said later, whatever it is."


Exactly.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby Urf » Sun Mar 14, 2010 12:40 am

If she could be convinced that there's a purpose in her turning sides that plays into her sense of destiny, she might do it... but she'd need some clear advantage to doing so.


Stanley without Wanda is much more dangerous and risky than Stanley with Wanda. Not sure Charlie sees it that way but Parson surely does.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby Angband » Sun Mar 14, 2010 12:41 am

DoctorJest wrote:I don't think so, Charley was very dismissive of the info about Wanda, which didn't even come up until AFTER he had the long pause.


Text Update #17 wrote:""What, Wanda? I just parleyed with her. If you hadn't had me under nondisclosure I could've turned her. She doesn't hate you, she'd probably work for you."

There was a long, long silence.


That's Plot Armour-level reading comprehension FAIL you got there.

DoctorJest wrote:I don't think Charley is terribly interested in Wanda at the moment.


Which, of course, is why he contacted Jillian before she could get two hexes away from Spacerock. That behavior is totally inconsistent with "interest".
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby Ansan Gotti » Sun Mar 14, 2010 1:58 am

Ansan Gotti wrote:My random theory of the day is that the next page will show Charlie talking with Wanda, and Wanda telling him something really creepy and unsettling, hence his reaction in this text update.


New day, new random theory.

Parson reaches out to call Charlie (which we know Charlie can accept, from past updates). He tells Charlie he knows he's behind the turn end, and that he's going to retaliate by broadcasting to every leader in the known world every secret of Charlie's that Parson has been able to divine from the captured Archons, unless Charlie does something (what, I'm not exactly sure) for Parson.

Hence Charlie's stress.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby DoctorJest » Sun Mar 14, 2010 2:46 am

Angband wrote:Which, of course, is why he contacted Jillian before she could get two hexes away from Spacerock. That behavior is totally inconsistent with "interest".


He's interested in the battle and the situation. He's not showing an interest in recruiting Wanda. His silence isn't about Wanda.

We need to set up some kind of betting pool site or something. Based on past performance and the tinfoil hat theories on this site, I'd make a KILLING.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby DoctorJest » Sun Mar 14, 2010 2:48 am

Ansan Gotti wrote:
Ansan Gotti wrote:My random theory of the day is that the next page will show Charlie talking with Wanda, and Wanda telling him something really creepy and unsettling, hence his reaction in this text update.


New day, new random theory.

Parson reaches out to call Charlie (which we know Charlie can accept, from past updates). He tells Charlie he knows he's behind the turn end, and that he's going to retaliate by broadcasting to every leader in the known world every secret of Charlie's that Parson has been able to divine from the captured Archons, unless Charlie does something (what, I'm not exactly sure) for Parson.

Hence Charlie's stress.


Better than the average theory of late, but we don't know for certain if Parson learned anything damaging from the Archons or not.
And that kind of threat seems a little... gauche for Parson. Plus, how likely are the RCC II to believe Parson in the first place?
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby Ansan Gotti » Sun Mar 14, 2010 10:28 am

DoctorJest wrote:Better than the average theory of late, but we don't know for certain if Parson learned anything damaging from the Archons or not.


It might be a bluff. And Charlie is also absurdly secretive, even about the little things.

And that kind of threat seems a little... gauche for Parson. Plus, how likely are the RCC II to believe Parson in the first place?


Agreed and agreed. It is a bit blatant for Parson. But sometimes desperate times call for desperate measures. From his perspective, it's about to be game over.

On the flip side, Charlie is now armed with info that would allow him to appease Parson ("Parson, I promise, I will tell Jillian not to wipe out Wanda's air force"). So it would be an interesting move-countermove in the chess match.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby Goshen » Sun Mar 14, 2010 1:26 pm

Vreejack wrote:Oh, another reason that Wanda will not turn to join Charlie...forgot to mention because it's the most obvious one...leaving one Arkentool user (Stanley) for another does not advance her goal of bringing them together. By burning bridges with Stanley it would actually hurt her goal.

Agreed. More importantly, It would pit her against Parson whose strategic prowess she rightly respects.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby SteveMB » Sun Mar 14, 2010 1:28 pm

Ansan Gotti wrote:Parson reaches out to call Charlie (which we know Charlie can accept, from past updates). He tells Charlie he knows he's behind the turn end, and that he's going to retaliate by broadcasting to every leader in the known world every secret of Charlie's that Parson has been able to divine from the captured Archons, unless Charlie does something (what, I'm not exactly sure) for Parson.

Hence Charlie's stress.


Parson might think of asking the bracer for a probability that Charlie was behind that -- but he'd probably wait until he has some privacy, for the same reason he didn't tell Stanley that Charlie was probably behind the gobwin dearth.
Is this a real holy war, or just a bunch of deluded boopholes croaking each other?
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby HandofShadows » Sun Mar 14, 2010 2:06 pm

Goshen wrote:Agreed. More importantly, It would pit her against Parson whose strategic prowess she rightly respects.


More than that. Wanda sees Parson as a tool of Fate (or the world Remember when she told Parson that the world wished for him?). Going against Parson would be going against Fate, and unless she totally looses faith, I don't she her doing it.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 017

Postby Urf » Sun Mar 14, 2010 3:21 pm

the same reason he didn't tell Stanley that Charlie was probably behind the gobwin dearth.


Sorry for being behind, but where do we learn this?
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