Book 2 – Text Updates 020

[shadowdemon]

At the moment all that Jetstone has gained is time, they have no reinfocements at the castle, and have lost their air support. At t the moment they have nowhere near the fire power required to successfully attack the horde of Dwagons in their airspace. They also seem to have lost any assistance that Sammy might have lent them in defense of their capital, considering that he seems unlikely to continue his support of Jet stone after fullfilling his obligations to Charlie. I guess it is concievable that Trammenis will force him to reinfoce Spacerock, but that might not even be worth the effort after Sammy loses half his forces assaulting Ansom (and yes I'm assuming he wont complete his objective, not against one of the finest warlords in all of Erfworld). The only real hope that Spacerock has at the moment is for Trammenis's forces to return without having suffered major losses (something Charlie did make more probable by manipulating Sammy).

Even if this does happen, whether or not Jetstone will have enough archers and air to successfully attack the Dwagon swarm is a good question. The Dwagon swarm wont be able to make a direct assault on Spacerock anymore, but most of the units Jetstone has can only be used in defense here. They might just fly off and go conquer other cities. In conclusion I think all that was accomplished by ending the turn pre-maturely was a stall for Jetstone, which will lilkely end up in them being able to escape total annihilation, but not a huge amount else.

[Ditto]

I'm wondering if Tramennis will be able to commit all that much to the fight against Ansom - they NEED to be back in the capital by turn's end, or else GK can go through with the original plan of sacking the garrison unimpeded. The archers will be of limited use when fighting across the chokepoint, anyway, so they should divert to Spacerock posthaste.

[Aquillion]

I'm wondering if Tramennis will be able to commit all that much to the fight against Ansom - they NEED to be back in the capital by turn's end, or else GK can go through with the original plan of sacking the garrison unimpeded.

No they won't. That plan depended on Jetstone not having a heir. Tramennis is almost without question heir now (it would be the first thing the king would do if he's not stupid.) That makes it suicidal to throw everything into a precision strike on the king, rather than an instant victory like it was before.

[SteveMB]

Interesting that Wanda feels physical pain when she deviates from her Fate. Could be psychosomatic, a curse or Fate magic itself - though on Erfworld these things aren't easily seperable.

I dunno -- it could simply be anxiety because Fate doesn't seem to be working out for her at the moment, making her worry that she's gotten off the path the Titans intend for her.

I'm wondering if Tramennis will be able to commit all that much to the fight against Ansom - they NEED to be back in the capital by turn's end, or else GK can go through with the original plan of sacking the garrison unimpeded.

No they won't. That plan depended on Jetstone not having a heir. Tramennis is almost without question heir now (it would be the first thing the king would do if he's not stupid.) That makes it suicidal to throw everything into a precision strike on the king, rather than an instant victory like it was before.

If he can -- it might require Tramennis to be in his direct presence in the capital. Promotion to Chief Warlord doesn't require that (a point I missed earlier), but the fact that he promoted Tramennis to Chief Warlord in the field without any mention of his becoming Heir as well would seem to support the notion that the latter was not an available option at that moment.

[Jeivar]

Wow. Interesting look at Wanda. She's either brutally realistic and aware, or frighteningly fatalistic and deluded. It'll be interesting to find out which.

And now she's made an error that involves Jillian? That would be either . . .
1) Not attacking immediately when she had the chance, rather than parley
2) Not taking Jillian's offer, and leave Stanley's side.

I'm intrigued by the second possibility. That would mean that the Tools are NOT necessarily meant to be brought together. At least not with Stanley involved. Or maybe they are meant to be brought AGAINST one another, and the resulting cataclysmic war would change Erfworld in some drastic way.

We shall see . . .

[regisminae]

The fact that people here are posting their tactical ideas raises a question in my mind:

Based on the degree to which we have seen information presented in comics or updates as if in response to question raised in the reaction threads, could it be that Wanda's explicit solicitation of suggestions is only ostensibly directed at the warlords, i.e. that it is really targeted at us?

I'm reasonably confident that Rob knows what he wants to do. Still, it wouldn't surprise me to see the next few comics or updates at least discuss ideas that readers are already submitting here.

[Alexei P]

But perversely, she did not want Parson's advice this time. Somehow, she felt it was now simply time to apply what he had taught her. She cleared her throat.

That's interesting. Is it me, or does Parson have that effect on everyone? All important units on his side know he is a genius, but somehow, they all strive to prove they can do just fine without him. Ansom thinks this way. Stanley thinks this way. Now Wanda as well. Generalized inferiority complex?

[djones520]

Back to speculation about the Heir thing. Can anyone point out any direct referrence that Tramennis has ever stopped being the heir? I never saw anything that I recalled that said Ansom was the Heir. Nor anything that says a kingdom has to specifically state an heir if one is croaked. We know of three "heirs" popped by Jetstone. If for some reason Slately decided to make Ansom #1 option of Tram, whose to say the status didn't automatically revert once Ansom got croaked?

Now, I may have missed something somewhere, and would appreciate some links pointing to specifics if possible, but as far as I'm aware, there is nothing but speculation on this Heir thing that I keep seeing being discussed as fact.

[Alexei P]

Back to speculation about the Heir thing. Can anyone point out any direct referrence that Tramennis has ever stopped being the heir? I never saw anything that I recalled that said Ansom was the Heir. Nor anything that says a kingdom has to specifically state an heir if one is croaked. We know of three "heirs" popped by Jetstone. If for some reason Slately decided to make Ansom #1 option of Tram, whose to say the status didn't automatically revert once Ansom got croaked?

Now, I may have missed something somewhere, and would appreciate some links pointing to specifics if possible, but as far as I'm aware, there is nothing but speculation on this Heir thing that I keep seeing being discussed as fact.

I think it's mostly Parson's statement from page 13: "You control the heir, so the whole side should fall. Or possibly convert, we don't know".

[splintermute]

In update 18, Charlie congratulated Sammy on Haggar's popping a "non-heir Royal warlord," (i.e. Sammy's getting a new brother/sister), which resolves the issue of whether Royals can be non-heirs.

Ansom was heir, and Ossomer was either also an heir, and second in line after Ansom, or appointed heir after Ansom's death. Tramennis is, presumably, a "non-heir Royal (chief) warlord," and we don't yet know the mechanism by which he'll be made heir (although I have no doubt that he'll eventually be made heir).

[djones520]

In update 18, Charlie congratulated Sammy on Haggar's popping a "non-heir Royal warlord," (i.e. Sammy's getting a new brother/sister), which resolves the issue of whether Royals can be non-heirs.

Ansom was heir, and Ossomer was either also an heir, and second in line after Ansom, or appointed heir after Ansom's death. Tramennis is, presumably, a "non-heir Royal (chief) warlord," and we don't yet know the mechanism by which he'll be made heir (although I have no doubt that he'll eventually be made heir).

Where is this stated though?

[splintermute]

In update 18, Charlie congratulated Sammy on Haggar's popping a "non-heir Royal warlord," (i.e. Sammy's getting a new brother/sister), which resolves the issue of whether Royals can be non-heirs.

Ansom was heir, and Ossomer was either also an heir, and second in line after Ansom, or appointed heir after Ansom's death. Tramennis is, presumably, a "non-heir Royal (chief) warlord," and we don't yet know the mechanism by which he'll be made heir (although I have no doubt that he'll eventually be made heir).

Where is this stated though?

In update 15 Tramennis is describing his forces: "There was a great deal of strength in this hex, all of Jetstone's top fighters and three of her four casters. All impotent. All likely to vanish at any moment."

If he were heir, the troops wouldn't be likely to vanish at any moment (in response to Slately's death), or at least not the casters and top fighters, which any sensible heir/warlord would put in his personal stack to protect them from disbanding.

[Decorus]

Even if he is the Heir if the city falls then Him and everyone with him becomes a Barbarian and he has to pay thier upkeep....

[Black]

The directive she gives her leadership corps parallels the one Parson gave to his at the end of the Battle of Gobwin Knob. Recall Wanda's attitude then and compare it to her attitude now. This is the most significant idea that can be drawn from the text update. It further characterizes Wanda's relationship to Erfworld, to her units, and to Parson.

[Dark Arbiter]

My thought is that perhaps the Heir is such as part of the unit type - sort of like a caster can be a Foolamancer, Croakamancer, etc. The Heir is the Heir no matter what, and so Slately can't simply say, "Oh, Ossomer is the Heir now." If that's the case, then they can't promote anyone else until Ansom croaks, because a side can only have one Heir at a time.

Otherwise, I feel like Slately would have appointed Tramennis the Heir at the same time that we saw him get promoted to Chief Warlord.

EDIT: and since it's such an important thing, we would have heard about it in one of the updates.

[gameboy1234]

My thought is that perhaps the Heir is such as part of the unit type - sort of like a caster can be a Foolamancer, Croakamancer, etc. The Heir is the Heir no matter what, and so Slately can't simply say, "Oh, Ossomer is the Heir now." If that's the case, then they can't promote anyone else until Ansom croaks, because a side can only have one Heir at a time.

Otherwise, I feel like Slately would have appointed Tramennis the Heir at the same time that we saw him get promoted to Chief Warlord.

EDIT: and since it's such an important thing, we would have heard about it in one of the updates.

I'm pretty sure Ansom was heir when we first met him, it's in his introduction. Same with Ossomer, when we first meet him in the summer updates, he's introduced as the new Jetstone heir.

This implies that heirs can be changed, that's it's not inherent. That Trammenis wasn't made heir immediately implies there has to be some prerequisite (which we don't know yet). It's presumed that the new heir has to be in the same hex has the ruler/overlord. C.f. Stanley's own "heir-ing" ceremony where he's being dubbed by King Saline IV.

[Dark Arbiter]

Same with Ossomer, when we first meet him in the summer updates, he's introduced as the new Jetstone heir.

Ah, forgot about that. Good call.

[The Game]

Wow. Interesting look at Wanda. She's either brutally realistic and aware, or frighteningly fatalistic and deluded. It'll be interesting to find out which.

And now she's made an error that involves Jillian? That would be either . . .
1) Not attacking immediately when she had the chance, rather than parley
2) Not taking Jillian's offer, and leave Stanley's side.

I'm intrigued by the second possibility. That would mean that the Tools are NOT necessarily meant to be brought together. At least not with Stanley involved. Or maybe they are meant to be brought AGAINST one another, and the resulting cataclysmic war would change Erfworld in some drastic way.

We shall see . . .

It might also mean that she simply regretted not blasting her when she had her at point blanc range at tBfGK when she fired off all of GK's air defences.

[Reclaimer]

"Ok, fine, lemme just fix my hair- oh wait! *Chuckle.* I don't have to!"

The hairmet was a nice touch.

Now, I've got to wonder just where Wanda's escaping to. Back to Ansom's line? And by extension, Jill? It would seem likely, especially given that they're gearing up for heavy combat rather than flying in loose formation to avoid arrows, and if she left then the story would be all about Jillian and Ansom.

Which would be lame.

[gameboy1234]

Same with Ossomer, when we first meet him in the summer updates, he's introduced as the new Jetstone heir.

Ah, forgot about that. Good call.

I have to take that back slightly. It's in book 2, after Ossomer is decrypted, Parson says that Ossomer is/was Jetstone's heir.

http://www.erfworld.com/book-2-archive/ ... -12-24.jpg

So at some point Ossomer must have been declared the heir. I can't find where Ansom was stated to be the heir, but the wiki says he was, so it must be some place.