Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby ftl » Mon Jun 14, 2010 9:45 pm

Nihila wrote:Yes, it's confusing, but I intend to reserve judgement until I have read at least a few more pages of Issue Two. I think that these Klogs are from the summer update timeframe, before the attack on Jetstone.


Yep, that makes the most sense to me. Jack even mentions these sorts of discussions in his own text update -

http://www.erfworld.com/wiki/index.php/LIAB_Text_21:

But his second greatest mental challenge had been working with the good Lord Hamster. For dozens of turns, he and the warlord had met in the Situation Room and gambled with the lives of imaginary millions. They had gamed scenarios from the fundamental to the ludicrous. They had fought epic engagements between unit types that didn't even exist.

"What if dwagons could tunnel?" his Lord would posit. "What if ships could travel on land?" And soon, Jack would be projecting a model battle in which dirt-burrowing dwagons clawed like sea serpents at the hulls of great wheeled galleons on grassy plains. Or a simple scenario would play out predictably, and Lord Parson would say, "Okay, now let's give all two thousand of those infantry the ability to cast like Archons, and see what happens." Marvelous. Marvelous.


This Klog and the previous one is likely an entry with notes from quite a number of turns ago.

Fits perfectly with the tone - "what if we had this weird scenario!"

Fits with why Parson would be looking at that klog right now - looking at the notes he'd accumulated.

Doesn't require any unusual happenings or sudden insights.
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby Squishalot » Mon Jun 14, 2010 11:02 pm

Random attack theory:

1) Falling units / objects will obey the laws of general Erfworld physics, right? So they can pass through hex / city boundaries once they start moving outside of the unit's control.

2) Therefore, a unit / object that is falling could fall onto the tower, but only if you could get the angle right, since the airspace directly above the tower isn't part of the 'airspace' zone, technically.

3) So, in theory, a unit could fall, bounce off a dwagon's side and gain some sideways velocity, allowing them to fall at an angle, and through that giant gap in the tower where Slately is hanging out.

Then again... the 'good' odds of winning were based on a full frontal assault with all troops on the tower. It stands to reason that with 33% of the troops (or some <100% amount), these odds would shrink significantly, so it's unlikely that any 'win' will occur on Jetstone's turn.
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby joosy » Tue Jun 15, 2010 12:05 am

In thd midst of these wild and crazy, incoherent, and otherwise froot loopy theories and baseless arguments, here are my random and silly thoughts:

As Jack pointed out, King Slately probably believes he has this in the bag. His ego and adherence to royal traditions may lead him to make a tactical error.

Much like Prince Ansom forming the troops into orderly columns, straightening his shirt, and making grandiose speeches while he went to his (initial) doom, Slately is probably going to make grand gestures of surrender terms. He pretty much has to at this juncture. By enforcing the customs of Royalty at this point he can deal a strong blow against Toolism.

As such, he probably believes that GK's forces in his airspace are already defeated. He may bring in Tramennis, the casters, and other archer units into the tower , and position the ground units directly below in revue as witnesses. He most likely plans to engage in some monologueing about how GK's defeat is inevitable and how surrender is really the only option, and save the arrows as a last resort.

However, if Parson's hinted gambit of raining men and other things that are not rain into Jetstone's courtyard then that would certainly suprise and confuse Jetstone long enough to tip the scales. Assuming Wanda survives the fall, they could lay waste to units in the courtyard and then Wanda could rez them and increase Gk's forces on the fly ( but still on the ground). I am curious to know Jack's part in this as his 'juice' is being saved for a reason. Also Wanda is a Croakamancer but aparently is adept in other disciplines as well. She also has full juice (assuming that none is needed for Decrypting) and could probably put her magic abilities to use as a luckmancer, healmancer, etc. assuming she doesn't need scrolls or other props for that.

And for those of you who are having trouble with the past two updates: These are notes from Parson's Klog from before Book 2: Issue 1. Back when he was gaming with Jack while Wanda and Ansom where reconquering GK's territory and then some. It should be obvious to even the more primitive lobes. If its still confusing I blame our current entertainment culture for its panderous overexplanation of the simplest things in order to not make the viewer engage in thinking.
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby dekkerd » Tue Jun 15, 2010 2:50 am

How many pink dwagons are in the airspace? To Breath weapons count as projectiles? What happens when an incoming arrow hits a "frpzen" bubble if so?
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby haviel » Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:08 am

@joosy

Please read my earlier post on why I think it's confusing. If the writer wants us to guess things in order to make the story make sense again then something is wrong. The Klogs are after issue 1 because Parson called Jack to talk about combat off turn. If it wasn't after issue 1 then it's more confusing still. Please give me a fair shake before insulting my intelligence.

I'm bored of this now, I'm sure the Erfworld train is back on course to awesome town by the next update. :D
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby Sixty » Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:43 am

haviel, Parson called Jack at the end of Issue 1 to propose "something", probably this something relates at least in part to the klogs in issue 2 which took place before Issue 1. We're seeing Parson's notes/Parson is going back over them so that when Parson mentions his plan it's not out of completely nowhere.

Parson calling to talk means we'll hear the plan (unless they do some Boondock Saints thing where we see the aftermath and then are explained what happened but that sounds rather unlikely) recited to Jack and the other relevant people. He isn't reading them his klog notes verbatim, they're just what is gonna be used to explain the plan. They were written down days, maybe weeks ago probably and they're just showing them to us now. The notes don't go away, so even though the klog was written in the past it could be being read in the present.
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby robak » Tue Jun 15, 2010 6:44 am

Sixty wrote:Parson calling to talk means we'll hear the plan (unless they do some Boondock Saints thing where we see the aftermath and then are explained what happened but that sounds rather unlikely) recited to Jack and the other relevant people.

NEVER EXPLAIN THE PLAN TO THE READERS!!!
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby kagato23 » Tue Jun 15, 2010 9:16 am

@haviel

Your getting stuck on the fact that Parson called Jack at the end of book one. But he wasn't calling to ask about anything, he said he was calling because he already HAD an idea. These klogs are taking place before hand, showing us how previous conversations between Jack and Parson led to his current idea. He made it clear for us by having Jack be in the room with Parson in the second Klog picture. Rob is good about stuff like that. So what everybody is telling you is correct, these klogs take place beforehand. There is no "dragon relay" to figure things out, your getting stuck on turn. These Klogs happened during summer updates, several turns before the assualt on Jetstone began.
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby SteveMB » Tue Jun 15, 2010 9:33 am

ftl wrote:Fits with why Parson would be looking at that klog right now - looking at the notes he'd accumulated.

It also fits the skipping from page to page ("Situation Room Tactical Notes 7" and "SRTN 11") -- he's specifically looking at the ones that pertain to the current situation (Our turn got cut off prematurely. What options do we have to work with? Will this "really ugly idea" work?)
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby haviel » Tue Jun 15, 2010 11:31 am

Alright, the last two guys gave me some context. And I thank you for it.

Remember what Jamie said to Rob during their Podcast. "You see, if you had the whole comic book in hand, you'd never do this. You'd never take a single page out of context. You wouldn't read one page of a comic and then go back to the register and say "F*** You, cancel my Subscription to X-Men..."

...so I'll still have to stick the label “incidentally confusing” on this whole thing, if for no other reason then the format of a Webcomic can create difficulties with following a narrative.
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby effataigus » Tue Jun 15, 2010 12:56 pm

Chit Rule Railroad wrote:
splintermute wrote:Since they can't go from airspace to tower, the courtyard is the next best thing - the courtyard, tower and dungeons are all part of the garrison. If the garrison is treated as a unitary zone, then they can enter the tower via the courtyard.


That's a good point. The Klog that introduces the parts of "the Garrison zone" (note the singular), describes the Tower, Courtyard and Dungeon as three "parts", not sub-zones. It goes on to say that "Once units are in any part of the garrison, then they can attack any other part of the garrison." Absent an in-comic indication that the three parts of the Garrison are separate zones that cost movement to traverse, it seems likely that GK can land in the Courtyard and take the Tower (and Slately) from there.


AHA! Alright, now I'm on board with the idea the the courtyard is part of the garrison zone... i.e. that units can probably "move" off turn from the courtyard to the tower and down to the dungeons (if Spacerock has one). As such, I now see how Gobwin Knob can get a lot of mileage out of dropping some units into the courtyard... perfect landing or no. As someone pointed out, Tramennis is still out in the field mopping up GK's stragglers. This means that if GK did this tactic and attacked the garrison right now then they'd be up against whatever units Jetstone left behind in the garrison... which we were led to believe was a piddling few. The 70% was GK vs. JS+Faq... now it's GK (post losses to falling) vs. JS. Might be better odds than 70% now depending on a lot of things. How many JS ground troops/defenses weren't mentioned because they were thought to be moot? How much does GK lose to falling? Is Wanda in a place where she can decrypt JS's and GK's fallen men (I've heard arguments on this and remain unconvinced whether she is currently in such a place)? Could a couple of dropped and decrypted purples and reds just roast/blast the tower zone into oblivion from the courtyard?

Mostly this begs the question of timing. I still don't understand Erfworld time fully so I don't know how "quickly" Tram could get back to town and start wrecking grounded troops once his side figures out what GK is up to... or how quickly a couple of grounded dragons could wreck the tower for that matter.

I'm now of the opinion that some variant on this is likely simply because it would be awesome to see/read and this comic is, if nothing else awesome.

Also, very well said just now, Haviel. You have also captured my frustration with this Klog and my rationale for trying to ignore my frustration perfectly. I think this page is written in such a way as to make the reader want nothing more than to flip to the next page. A great thing for a story, but absolutely painful for a caught-up reader who can't flip to the next page. If we were reading these one after another we also wouldn't have had quite so much time to speculate about whether units can cross zones... therefore the timing of this entry wouldn't seem so convenient.
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby JustDoug » Tue Jun 15, 2010 1:59 pm

BLANDCorporatio wrote:Parson can try to tell Erfworlders about something genuinely new to them. Consent. That's because Parson knows what that is, and Erfworlders don't.

OTOH, Erfworlders know better than Parson what a Dwagon is, or what a Crap Golem is, or what Weirdomancy does.

I don't require all Erfworlders to be Feynmanns. But you seem to require that all Erfworlders be idiots, and it's either patently untrue or jarringly weird if true after all.

Because, since Erfworld is big bla-bla etc, and the tech level seems stable, surely by now a world dedicated to warfare and murder has discovered what murderous methods are possible at this tech level. Even if there are only a few smart and initiative-driven people. Earth works like that too.


No, I don't require all Erfworlders to be idiots. I'm sure there are many very, brilliant minds that come up with even more brilliant insights concerning life as they know it.

Where I differ from you take on it is that they don't seem to question the +simple+ things. Jack, who seems to be wonderfully sharp, never really wondered about how falling works when hex boundaries are involved. It wasn't because he was a dolt but because he already knows how things work, so why bother? As has been noted elsewhere, there seems to be nothing anywhere near to the Scientific method on Erf and natural philosophy there resembles the classic Greek approach to investigating the Way of The World: think about it a lot, argue with others about it, and whatever sounds best wins. I doubt they would have come up with quantum mechanics that way.

Parson doesn't have to be any Einstein to shake things up: all he has to do is wonder about it and ask those seemingly stupid questions. He's in a perfect position to do so, because he doesn't know. He's a walking scientific revolution and renaissance even if his IQ isn't stellar (and seems to have been purpose-picked for that role- needs of plot and Erfworld notwithstanding). Call it pandering, but without that the story would be rather flat.

Parson asked Jack about boundaries and falling and got a, "Why would you bother asking about that?" look in reply. That's rather like someone asking Newton why he was spending all that time and effort thinking about gravity. "Gravity works! Things fall! Every body knows that! Why are you wasting your time? " It's understandable, as most people don't often ask questions about Things As They Are.

Bringing military innovation into this rather proves my point, too. Look back to The Great War. They kept doing the same thing- fix bayonets and over the top, boys!- that had worked so well previously until they finally figured out that it no longer worked. If the Old Ways of pound-them-with-the-guns-then-mass-charge had worked, do you think they would have gone through all the time, effort and expense developing things like armored fighting vehicles, attack aircraft and combined arms tactics, essentially changing everything? No, they would have worked to make artillery better and the charges more effective, and probably would have, too. The Same Old, only better and outtandingly performed.

While innovation isn't totally unknown to the military between jobs, remember what happened to people like Billy Mitchell and Naval aircraft carrier proponents until it was pretty obvious that doing things the old way no longer worked.

No, the military are not all idiots either. Sometimes, they pick up on technology and new ways from "outside" real quick- like trains and telegraphs during the American Civil War. They aren't at all loath to do some heavy duty thinking when they're on the job. However, I doubt they're much for fundamental research or philosophy most times or tinkering with current "tried and true methods". History shows they tend to have a rather high amount of inertia when faced with such, which is why a change in the paradigm of warfare is one of those things that get highlighted in the history books.
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby Carne » Tue Jun 15, 2010 3:01 pm

JustDoug wrote:Parson doesn't have to be any Einstein to shake things up: all he has to do is wonder about it and ask those seemingly stupid questions.


Which, ironically, is actually the approach Einstein is said to have taken when trying to work out relativity (for greater or lesser values of stupid, of course).
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby SteveMB » Tue Jun 15, 2010 3:31 pm

JustDoug wrote:Where I differ from you take on it is that they don't seem to question the +simple+ things. Jack, who seems to be wonderfully sharp, never really wondered about how falling works when hex boundaries are involved. It wasn't because he was a dolt but because he already knows how things work, so why bother? As has been noted elsewhere, there seems to be nothing anywhere near to the Scientific method on Erf and natural philosophy there resembles the classic Greek approach to investigating the Way of The World: think about it a lot, argue with others about it, and whatever sounds best wins. I doubt they would have come up with quantum mechanics that way.

Parson doesn't have to be any Einstein to shake things up: all he has to do is wonder about it and ask those seemingly stupid questions. He's in a perfect position to do so, because he doesn't know. He's a walking scientific revolution and renaissance even if his IQ isn't stellar (and seems to have been purpose-picked for that role- needs of plot and Erfworld notwithstanding). Call it pandering, but without that the story would be rather flat.

Parson asked Jack about boundaries and falling and got a, "Why would you bother asking about that?" look in reply. That's rather like someone asking Newton why he was spending all that time and effort thinking about gravity. "Gravity works! Things fall! Every body knows that! Why are you wasting your time? " It's understandable, as most people don't often ask questions about Things As They Are.


Also, Erfworlders come into existence already knowing the basics of what they need to know, and their cities come into existence stocked with libraries containing anything they might need to look up. If anything, it's surprising that some of them (like Sizemore) have any concept whatsoever of trying to figure out for yourself how the world works and why.

EDIT: This could also lead to religious doctrines being more hidebound than anything we've seen in the real world -- i.e. "All knowledge is clearly and visibly handed down direct from the Titans; who are you to question any of it?"
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby BLANDCorporatio » Tue Jun 15, 2010 3:47 pm

Carne wrote:
JustDoug wrote:Parson doesn't have to be any Einstein to shake things up: all he has to do is wonder about it and ask those seemingly stupid questions.


Which, ironically, is actually the approach Einstein is said to have taken when trying to work out relativity (for greater or lesser values of stupid, of course).


*wince*

He did not ask stupid questions dangit! A) they were not stupid and B) he didn't ask them!

Spoiler: show
The problem that was to be answered by special relativity was known since the Mikelson-Morley experiment. How come light seems to have the same speed in all directions to all observers, if light is a wave in some kind of immobile luminiferous ether? Here's what Einstein did and provided a "silly" (as in, not to the fashion of the time) answer: there is no ether. Next came the General Relativity thing, which was not a stupid question at all, but an extension. Special Rel. works for inertial observers. What about accelerated ones?


JustDoug wrote:Where I differ from you take on it is that they don't seem to question the +simple+ things. Jack, who seems to be wonderfully sharp, never really wondered about how falling works when hex boundaries are involved. It wasn't because he was a dolt but because he already knows how things work, so why bother? As has been noted elsewhere, there seems to be nothing anywhere near to the Scientific method on Erf and natural philosophy there resembles the classic Greek approach to investigating the Way of The World: think about it a lot, argue with others about it, and whatever sounds best wins. I doubt they would have come up with quantum mechanics that way.


Now, Parson introducing the Scientific Method to the Magic Kingdom would be something genuinely new.

Thinking about falling though? I dunno, even if the Ancients did not know about Mm/R^2, I'm sure they understood well enough all that there was there to use, tactically, from gravity, at their tech level.

Since Newton got mentioned again, a little more ranting on that topic. "Everybody saw the apple fall, but only Newton asked why" goes the anecdote. Well, the other side of the story goes like

Spoiler: show
So the previous generation (Kepler) had described laws for how the planets moved. Why were these laws in place? Actually several people pondered the idea, and got far enough with an answer that Newton was embroiled in a priority dispute with Robert Hooke over who ows what to whom for the law of gravity. Christopher Wren also made some contributions there.

Also, famously, Newton did not answer WHY the apple fell. "I propose no hypothesis" for how a force at a distance works.

Anyway, in principle, if Newton fell sick, someone else would have found that Mm/R^2 thing. But in this case, Newton was well ahead of the contemporaries.

A much more acrimonious photo-finish was that against Leibniz, about who invented calculus first/independently.

Later on, and without the dispute, Gauss, Lobachevski and Bolyai all started developping hyperbolic geometry. That was when the phrase "an idea whose time has come" was coined.

Charles Darwin was urged by friends to hurry up and publish Origin of Species, because it looked like Alfred Russel Wallace was thinking in a similar vein.

The three recipients for the Physics Nobel Prize for Q.E.D. also worked without knowing much of each other's works until the mid-game.

What happens in all such cases is that there are certain problems, and as several people will make stabs at them, some will come up with essentially the same answers.

But we need to keep our history simple, so we tend to stick with the first. That's one of the conclusions.

The other conclusion is that, often, the questions that are raised in science are not exactly provided by those who answer them. A lot/most progress comes from people trying to answer what stumped the previous generation, while in turn, providing a clear statement of their own stumbling blocks to the next generation.



JustDoug wrote:Bringing military innovation into this rather proves my point, too. Look back to The Great War. They kept doing the same thing- fix bayonets and over the top, boys!- that had worked so well previously until they finally figured out that it no longer worked. If the Old Ways of pound-them-with-the-guns-then-mass-charge had worked, do you think they would have gone through all the time, effort and expense developing things like armored fighting vehicles, attack aircraft and combined arms tactics, essentially changing everything? No, they would have worked to make artillery better and the charges more effective, and probably would have, too. The Same Old, only better and outtandingly performed.


The Great War is indeed a great example of what happens when the technology on the battlefield radically changes. And change it did, and left tactical doctrine a bit behind maybe. This was the war that saw the introduction of the tank, the airplane and the submarine.

The problem ... well, one problem ... then was that the machine gun had been invented, but not yet something to compensate for that on the offensive side. This resulted in the war of crazy stupid repetitive charges we now know about.

Tactical doctrine changed, because technology changed. I'm not too familiar with the history of carriers, but it looks like those were expensive ships to build, and several sides, USA included, had invested enough to have a few lying around. And when the war came, they proved themselves superior to battleships. If something works, it will get adopted, hang-ups, biases and inertia be damned.

OTOH, for whatever reason, technology in Erfworld seems quite stable. Again, It would be interesting to see Parson show how SCIENCE works to the Magic Kingdom, say. But until then, I believe there have been Pikers and Stabbers and Archers and Flying Mounts (and Dirt Bombs) since before Charlie was a baby Dish.

SteveMB wrote:Also, Erfworlders come into existence already knowing the basics of what they need to know, and their cities come into existence stocked with libraries containing anything they might need to look up. If anything, it's surprising that some of them (like Sizemore) have any concept whatsoever of trying to figure out for yourself how the world works and why.


enthar wrote:I actually want to touch on this again. One of the ongoing threads being discussed is the notion that Erfworld has very poor communication of ideas between 'cultures' (sides). Which is why I made my point about experience. OUR military makes a point of finding out everything they can about how other people fight. Erfworld largely doesn't have that luxury. {...}

My point being, that some people have no doubt done as you suggest, somewhere on Erf BUT even if true (somewhere on the plane, somewhen in time), there are few to no central repositories of institutional knowledge such as our militaries have. When a side dies, its the beginning of a local dark age- all their knowledge and experience is wiped out. New sides have to reinvent the wheel constantly, and very likely in parallel with everyone around them.


That is, indeed, the strange thing.

It's very important to not need to reinvent the wheel all the time, and use the experience of others, your own forebears or your enemies, as much as possible.

Erfworlders seem handicapped at this. They have no useful archives, and nothing to suggest a need for learning.

But, they learn nonetheless. And not in that much less a quantity than Earthlings either. Synthesists like Sizemore are rare here also.

Finally one more thing, stolen from a book by Jared Diamond I read ages ago. The Aborigines of Australia may have not had any system of writing and keeping records, but they could live in their continent quite well. If some uppity European explorer would have come by and asked the "simple question": "how come you're not growing more of your food and such?", well because there's a simple answer. The ground is hard as rock and there are no oxes to pull the plows anyways.

Oh, and some uppity European explorers did in fact come by. Some of them died there. Food for thought. Outside perspective is not everything.
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby BLANDCorporatio » Tue Jun 15, 2010 3:53 pm

SteveMB wrote:EDIT: This could also lead to religious doctrines being more hidebound than anything we've seen in the real world -- i.e. "All knowledge is clearly and visibly handed down direct from the Titans; who are you to question any of it?"


Eh, for some reason this comparison is driving me crazy. I'm not discussing whether or not there's an afterlife here, I'm discussing the uses of pikes!

And I don't care if said uses are handed down by the Titans or Azathoth or immutable impersonal Physical Laws, but that's what they are. And you (somebody from another universe) really DO in fact have a lot of catching up to do before even hoping to add anything.

PS: this is not to exclude Parson from being a very, very good Warlord. He's a quick learner, well respected by his own side, has good ideas. May even pull the occasional bit of diplomacy now and then. Speculating about Parson as a sole tactical innovator of Erfworld is what gets my goat.
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby asparagus » Tue Jun 15, 2010 6:38 pm

I think I just made . This latest comic talked about how Wierdomancers can add or remove special abilities. During the intermission Jack and Parson gamed impossible scenarios such as ships that could cross land etc etc. Probably a wierdomancer could grant that ability to a ship. May be Maggie will be asked to contact Sizemore and say "Whilst you're still in the Magic Kingdom, could you hire a wierdomancer?"
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby Ansan Gotti » Tue Jun 15, 2010 7:17 pm

BLANDCorporatio wrote:OTOH, for whatever reason, technology in Erfworld seems quite stable. Again, It would be interesting to see Parson show how SCIENCE works to the Magic Kingdom, say. But until then, I believe there have been Pikers and Stabbers and Archers and Flying Mounts (and Dirt Bombs) since before Charlie was a baby Dish.


That's because every unit that pops is essentially the same. There is no change, there is no increase in technology. Again, this militates in favor of a static, non-creative situation. Add to that the limited information available to sides, and the bias in favor of mindless obedience rather than potentially results-in-disbanding innovation, and you have a situation where people don't innovate. Parson is a new element. And to a lesser extent, so are some of the folks from FAQ, who spent an extremely long time under a philosopher-king who hid from war.
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby effataigus » Tue Jun 15, 2010 8:03 pm

Aye, if they can land and if it is a good idea then why hasn't the strike force thought of it? We know we can't fly, but we still jump out of high windows of burning buildings. Maybe they haven't seen the tactical advantage of it yet?

Something tells me they aren't scared of doing it. Especially Wanda... if the Titans are guiding her they wouldn't kill her with a fall.

I'm guessing Weirdomancers have been hard at work in Erfworld for a long time. I've heard they can also make Klogs end mid-sentence and stop forum posters from
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Re: Book 2 – Parson’s Klog 002

Postby ftl » Tue Jun 15, 2010 8:21 pm

effataigus wrote:Aye, if they can land and if it is a good idea then why hasn't the strike force thought of it? We know we can't fly, but we still jump out of high windows of burning buildings. Maybe they haven't seen the tactical advantage of it yet?

Something tells me they aren't scared of doing it. Especially Wanda... if the Titans are guiding her they wouldn't kill her with a fall.

I'm guessing Weirdomancers have been hard at work in Erfworld for a long time. I've heard they can also make Klogs end mid-sentence and stop forum posters from


I'm waiting to run into a Weirdomancer named candleja
ftl
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