Book 2 – Page 40

Page by page discussion of the comic.

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby effataigus » Thu Sep 02, 2010 11:54 am

Wender wrote:
Snowtitan wrote:
BCCroaker wrote:"Charlescomm's neutrality has never waived".
Surely that should "wavered".


Not so sure about that, in a contract, you can waive a clause, it may be an intentional misdirection.


If so, it's ungrammatical. Neutrality would be the clause, so it would never have been waived. In other words, the object is in the position of the subject, and the subject is missing.

One way or another, it's wrong. So if ambiguity was Charlie's goal, he succeeded.


RETCONJURED!!! This needs a sound effect.
Last edited by effataigus on Thu Jun 30, 2011 9:31 am, edited 239044 times in total.
User avatar
effataigus
 
Posts: 944
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:49 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby effataigus » Thu Sep 02, 2010 12:34 pm

Lor wrote:Why does Trem look disappointed at Charlie's emphasis of familiarity?


I had the same initial reading as you, though when I tried to actually make the face that Tramennis was making, I could only do it as part of a dubious and sarcastic nod of respect... I now kinda interpret it as a "bemused playing along."

I have my doubts that Parson is grabbing a sword as a symbol. Yes, symbols are powerful, but if he was that concerned with image his armor wouldn't have pizza stains and a fat hamster on it. I'm pretty sure he intends to use whatever he gets in the armory. So, what might he be grabbing?

zilfallon wrote:As another person said, using rations in this plan has been suggested, though what you meant is different, and highly unlikely. GK's airforce is currently outnumbered, really bad. I don't think GK has an item which can make a losing force overpower the winning. There has been no foreshadowing of this, and if they happen to have a "secret armor/weapon which they kept in armory even when they sent everything they have to a crusade", THAT would be an asspull. If that happens, NO ONE has the right to blame KW for being an asspull. But as i said, i don't think this is the case.


Well, I don't buy this theory, but, for the sake of argument, the secret GK cheat-win item could be the pliers. If they are able to sneak weapons up to the air column then all they would need would be a bunch of bricks and/or crossbows. It's been established that someone on high could take pot shots at people down below even without the "archery special" as long as they had something to throw. Yes, odds are low, but they'd have a ton of targets and they'd only need to take out enough of Jetstone's men to start a decryption chain reaction of sorts.

Now to the part where I dismiss the theory I just advocated... if this was the plan, then Maggie wouldn't be surprised that Parson is on his way to put the plan into motion. Clearly whatever he is grabbing is not part of the plan as discussed over the thinkagram. As added speculation, I'm guessing that Maggie would object to whatever Parson is about to do, or else he'd have told her what he's thinking.

Taken as a whole, this strip suggests to me that Parson is about to risk his own life in this conflict somehow... Portal hopping, defending himself against a counterattack that he has anticipated (and that I haven't), or something else. I wonder if Parson will level.

I love the verbal sparring between Charlie and Tram, but it didn't seem to teach the readers or the characters anything they didn't already know. Frustrating right now because I am eagerly awaiting something happening, but, I'm pretty sure this page will shine with Erfwordly goodness when the book is all together and I only have to wait two more seconds for the next page instead of two more weeks.
Last edited by effataigus on Thu Jun 30, 2011 9:31 am, edited 239044 times in total.
User avatar
effataigus
 
Posts: 944
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:49 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby effataigus » Thu Sep 02, 2010 12:43 pm

No sooner had I posted than I thought of a counter to what I had just said:

The only reason I could see that Parson would need to go to the armory to put this plan in motion that Maggie wouldn't have anticipated is if Parson decided that he would croak the units being transported as "food" (i.e. dead spidews or something edible). This would be something I can imagine him thinking he has the responsibility to do now that he is recognizing the moral implications of butchering (and serving) his own troops. Also, he would have a chance of leveling from it, and, if he leveled, it would give his troops on the front line a +1 (assuming CW bonus is 1/3rd round down instead of 1/3rd round up (or to nearest)).

This could be part of a plan to use dead meat as a "brick" weapon, as decryption fodder, or both.

The foreshadowing of him treating himself like a unit would apply equally well to a line of thought about him making himself level as it would to him putting himself in harm's way.
Last edited by effataigus on Thu Jun 30, 2011 9:31 am, edited 239044 times in total.
User avatar
effataigus
 
Posts: 944
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:49 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby Welf von Ehrwald » Thu Sep 02, 2010 1:30 pm

Whoa, butchering your own troops, get them into the larder as provisions, then send them to the air column and then decrypt them. That'd be evil. Really. Evil.
I love uncroaked Dora. I love an anonymous friend even more.

Only one man has understood me, and even he has not!
User avatar
Welf von Ehrwald
 
Posts: 467
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:57 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby TheWombat » Thu Sep 02, 2010 1:39 pm

So let me see if I get these references

1. Lucky Charms Rainbow
2. Rainbow Bright Rainbow
3. Care Bears Rainbow
4. NBC's PSA Rainbow
5. UN Rainbow / Rainbow 6?
Proud wanna-be owner of the Arken-chainsaw.
User avatar
TheWombat
 
Posts: 30
Joined: Fri May 01, 2009 9:46 am
Location: Land of the Mouse

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby build6 » Thu Sep 02, 2010 1:42 pm

Welf von Ehrwald wrote:Whoa, butchering your own troops, get them into the larder as provisions, then send them to the air column and then decrypt them. That'd be evil. Really. Evil.


but - sword of ruthlessness having been discarded notwithstanding - we all really can imagine Parson doing it, can't we?
build6
 
Posts: 201
Joined: Sun Sep 20, 2009 5:07 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby Lord Kasavin » Thu Sep 02, 2010 1:51 pm

TheWombat wrote:So let me see if I get these references

1. Lucky Charms Rainbow
2. Rainbow Bright Rainbow
3. Care Bears Rainbow
4. NBC's PSA Rainbow
5. UN Rainbow / Rainbow 6?


I thought number 3 might be a Hello Kitty image. Scratch that, I KNOW it is.

Image

Edit: No, I had never seen that shirt before and have no particular interest in Hello Kitty brand merchandise. However, the cat ears on Slately made be think kitty, and then using Google's image search with the words "hello kitty cloud" I arrived at that picture.

Edit2: The "hello kitty cloud" search also gave me this image...

Image

...which I just wanted to share.
"Act, and God will Act." - Joan of Arc

"Those who plot the destruction of others often perish in the attempt." - Thomas Moore
User avatar
Lord Kasavin
 
Posts: 378
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2009 5:34 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby splintermute » Thu Sep 02, 2010 2:23 pm

effataigus wrote:
I have my doubts that Parson is grabbing a sword as a symbol. Yes, symbols are powerful, but if he was that concerned with image his armor wouldn't have pizza stains and a fat hamster on it. I'm pretty sure he intends to use whatever he gets in the armory. So, what might he be grabbing?



Those aren't pizza stains and a fat hamster decal on his armor, they're symbols of office that were etched into the metal by Bogroll himself. He'll never get rid of it - the armor has too much sentimental value.
splintermute
 
Posts: 436
Joined: Sun Oct 25, 2009 10:53 am

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby zilfallon » Thu Sep 02, 2010 2:35 pm

Well, I don't buy this theory, but, for the sake of argument, the secret GK cheat-win item could be the pliers. If they are able to sneak weapons up to the air column then all they would need would be a bunch of bricks and/or crossbows. It's been established that someone on high could take pot shots at people down below even without the "archery special" as long as they had something to throw. Yes, odds are low, but they'd have a ton of targets and they'd only need to take out enough of Jetstone's men to start a decryption chain reaction of sorts.


effataigus, I didn't oppose the theory which suggests pliers as Gk's secret cheat-win item. I think you thought i said that because of:

GK's airforce is currently outnumbered, really bad. I don't think GK has an item which can make a losing force overpower the winning.


But there is a following sentence which explains what i meant by saying "item", replying to a person who said Parson might be going to armory to get a powerful item which will turn the tide:

if they happen to have a "secret armor/weapon which they kept in armory even when they sent everything they have to a crusade", THAT would be an asspull.


Well, now i notice it isn't exactly clear, but reading this second sentence should really explain what i meant, right? Let's not read half of a post :D

Also, people here speculated about croaking edible troops and sending them to the air force via larder, as rations. But there hasn't been any indication of supplies being transported MANUALLY. All supplies are sent automatically. Well, because if it was manual, who did all the sending? Leader of the side? Yes, i think all GK troops would just starve if Stanley had the duty to supply his troops manually :D So i think supplies are sent without manual control, but i wonder if it is possible to do so manually.

Maybe this is what Parson meant by saying "It's a cheat and it might not work.".

And uhm...What's the deal with lots of posts arguing about a small typo which doesn't make a difference in what we understand at all? Waivered or wavered, i'm pretty sure everyone here understood what Charlie meant there...
rkyeun wrote:Roses are red.
Violets are blue.

Image
User avatar
zilfallon
 
Posts: 565
Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2009 3:47 am
Location: Magic Kingdom

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby TheWombat » Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:17 pm

Lord Kasavin wrote:
TheWombat wrote:So let me see if I get these references

1. Lucky Charms Rainbow
2. Rainbow Bright Rainbow
3. Care Bears Rainbow
4. NBC's PSA Rainbow
5. UN Rainbow / Rainbow 6?


I thought number 3 might be a Hello Kitty image. Scratch that, I KNOW it is.

Edit: No, I had never seen that shirt before and have no particular interest in Hello Kitty brand merchandise. However, the cat ears on Slately made be think kitty, and then using Google's image search with the words "hello kitty cloud" I arrived at that picture.

Edit2: The "hello kitty cloud" search also gave me this image...

...which I just wanted to share.


Seems you're right about number 2. I thought he looked like a carebear and that the rainbows looked like the star shaped telescope or whatever.
Proud wanna-be owner of the Arken-chainsaw.
User avatar
TheWombat
 
Posts: 30
Joined: Fri May 01, 2009 9:46 am
Location: Land of the Mouse

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby effataigus » Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:33 pm

zilfallon wrote:Well, now i notice it isn't exactly clear, but reading this second sentence should really explain what i meant, right? Let's not read half of a post :D


I think you were clear enough and I actually was mostly agreeing with you. I cited your bit to indicate which mini-thread I was jumping into only. Really I was trying to provide evidence against any version of the "Parson is going to the armory to get an item to send to the air column" argument. What I said got confusing when I tried to anticipate that the argument might eventually expand to include anything that could be used to turn the tide of the battle, be it a stack of bricks (or of helmets) or an ICBM.

splintermute wrote:Those aren't pizza stains and a fat hamster decal on his armor, they're symbols of office that were etched into the metal by Bogroll himself. He'll never get rid of it - the armor has too much sentimental value.


I suppose a cleaner argument for why Parson's image wouldn't be high on his priorities right now is that he is not visible to the troops that are currently threatened.

Hee hee hee... Hello Kitty Cloud.
Last edited by effataigus on Thu Jun 30, 2011 9:31 am, edited 239044 times in total.
User avatar
effataigus
 
Posts: 944
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:49 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby zilfallon » Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:44 pm

@effataigus:

Ah sorry, but when you said "I don't agree with this theory, but just for the sake of argument..." quoting my post, i got confused :)

And now that you explain, i get what you say. As i've said, i don't believe there are any items in GK's armory which could turn the tide. (GK has such an item, it is the pliers, and it is in the field, not armory. This was my point)

And I don't even think sending items is possible. I think every item and creature has a boolean stat called Edible. If it is false, it can't be used as ration. But well, rations could transfer very well, and most rations are croaked animals, and spidews are edible too. Wanda only needs a small number of Jetstone units croaked, to start a decyrption chain and turn the tide.

But really...GK shouldn't be entirely dwagon/decrypted dependent. With pliers, any unit they train has 2 lives and they have MANY cities now...They should start investing in future to abuse this.
rkyeun wrote:Roses are red.
Violets are blue.

Image
User avatar
zilfallon
 
Posts: 565
Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2009 3:47 am
Location: Magic Kingdom

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby Nihila » Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:54 pm

zilfallon wrote:And I don't even think sending items is possible. I think every item and creature has a boolean stat called Edible. If it is false, it can't be used as ration. But well, rations could transfer very well, and most rations are croaked animals, and spidews are edible too. Wanda only needs a small number of Jetstone units croaked, to start a decyrption chain and turn the tide.
While I think that spidews might be edible... Yuck! Eating a part of a 3 foot tall spider! Does no one else find this a little disgusting?
"The Infantrymen of Erfworld have nothing to lose but their chains. They have Erfworld to win. Infantry of all sides: Unite!"--Kawl Mawx, Master-class Moneymancer
Nihila
 
Posts: 750
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2010 5:09 pm
Location: Probably totally lost.

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby sebastian » Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:58 pm

Welf von Ehrwald wrote:Whoa, butchering your own troops, get them into the larder as provisions, then send them to the air column and then decrypt them. That'd be evil. Really. Evil.

Yeah, that's it, that would make that part where Slately said they had to "harvest" some units for sustenance, foreshadowing.

and would explain the foodfight comment.

I think that could horrify even Wanda.
sebastian
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2009 3:07 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby GlueDuck » Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:04 pm

sebastian wrote:
Welf von Ehrwald wrote:I think that could horrify even Wanda.

Doubt it, remember how she wanted to croak Jack because 'they were low on healomancy scrolls'?
GlueDuck
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 10:34 am

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby Pointyleaf » Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:07 pm

Welf von Ehrwald wrote:Whoa, butchering your own troops, get them into the larder as provisions, then send them to the air column and then decrypt them. That'd be evil. Really. Evil.


Well, as long as we're talking crazy, why not butcher GK troops, toss the bodies through the MK portal, where Maggie (who's in the MK) tosses them through the portal into Jetstone's capital. The bodies fly out of the portal, Wanda decrypts them. Free (no-move-required) troops!
Pointyleaf
 
Posts: 78
Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2009 11:54 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby KonradKnox » Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:08 pm

The person secretly funding Charlie's campaign against GK is Wanda.

Please please let's get to the battle!
KonradKnox
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2010 1:04 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby ftl » Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:11 pm

I'm not at all convinced by all the 'use the MK portals' ideas.

Is there any reason to believe that the MK casters would be okay with that? Notwithstanding the other ways in which it might not work (maybe you can't use others sides' portals), I really don't think the MK would appreciate being used as a combat staging area. They were quite ready to croak Parson, a warlord, when he came through; and nowadays they don't even like GK much at all, even to the point of disliking Sizemore. I think the casters in the MK would put a pretty quick end to attempts to use the portals for war.
ftl
Erfabet Supporter!
Erfabet Supporter!
 
Posts: 1100
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 5:15 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby ftl » Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:25 pm

[quote="KonradKnox"]The person secretly funding Charlie's campaign against GK is Wanda.
[quote]

Aah! I just had another guess! One that would make all of Charlie's ass-pulls make sense!

Maybe I've heard this somewhere here before, but it could be the hippiemancer Janis (or the predictamancers working with her or whatever) funding Charlie against GK. Her purpose in this would be to push Parson to break War itself, to break Erf. In this case, it would make perfect sense for her to tell Charlie to use the bare minimum force necessary to beat GK - she wants to create situations that are winnable for Parson, but only with world-breaking unconventional tactics. Thus, this would explain why he keeps pulling out his powers at the last minute - he could perhaps help Jetstone curb-stomp GK more straightforwardly and with less hiding powers in the shadows, but he hasn't been hired to do that, so he doesn't.

It would be a variation on the theme of book 1, but different enough to not be the same thing over again.

Sorry if this post should better go in a different charlie-speculation thread.
ftl
Erfabet Supporter!
Erfabet Supporter!
 
Posts: 1100
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 5:15 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 40

Postby ParsonIsOP » Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:52 pm

timh wrote:This made me wonder, why Charlie is even bothered with preserving Jetstone..

Charlie never really struck me as a pro bono kind of guy, I assumed he was helping Jillian to keep this conflict going on so he could profit from it. But by now it should be clear that Jetstone is broke.. they cant afford Charlies help and even if he helps there is no guarantee that Jetstone survives whatever Gobwin Knob is going to do.
Either way, Jetstone is screwed... even if they survive any other side can wals over their surrounding cities and I'm convinced Jetstone wont be back in its initial position of power within the next dozen turns or so.

So....why bother? Charlie cant profit from Jetstone, that much is clear. Perhaps he could deal with Jetstone and get some other kind of compensation. (free information, free protection, free cloth golems for Charlie, free use of Jetstones casters ect.) but that'd all have a hugely negative drawback for Jetstone, so chances are that anything Charlie wants from them will result in the destruction of Jetstone.

I'm pretty sure its safe to say, that the big reason Charlie is helping out in this conflict is the fact that he wants Gobwin Knob to fail. Which implies that Charlie has a strategic intrest in this conflict, which in turn implies that he does have a strategy other then "Get more archons" He's up to something big, methinks.

I can boil all this down for you:
Stanley hates Charlie and wants to conquer the world.

That alone is reason enough for Charlie to oppose GK.

===

The strip is probably trying to imply that Parson will personally take the field. He's telling Maggie that he feels uncomfortable with playing the rear-echelon commander and is putting down his own piece to represent his presence in the battle. Hence, he's going to the armory to get suited-up for battle.

And he can get to GK by dragon-relay.
ParsonIsOP
 
Posts: 93
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 1:59 am

PreviousNext

Return to Reactions

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: arbo, Bing [Bot], haloInverse, Salvage and 17 guests