Book 2 – Page 41

[Lamech]

I think that what everyone is forgetting is that behind every facade of power is a man (or sapient hominid), with the limitations and fallibilities inherent thereto. For all of Charlie's power, for all of his subleties, for all of his reputation, he is but a piece in the game. A big piece, a unique piece, but . . . a piece. Parson is a player. Something Charlie can possibly never be. And this is terrifying to Charlie. Possibly to Janis as well, though Janis can see beyond the fear to the possibilities that Parson represents.

Consider that Parson is beyond Erf reality, and may, indeed, embody Titanic potential.

I don't see why Charlie would be any less of a player than Parson. (Especially since Parson seems to most definitly not be a "player" if you know what I mean.) I thought one of the motifs of Erf was the units are not just pieces.

[kreszantas]

Parson looks like a potato. Stanley confirmed that Parson looks like a "giant potato man," so apparently Tramennis agrees about Parson's un-warlord-like appearance.

I didn't take it that way.

Charlie says that Parson is "The most dangerous being in Erfworld".

The response "What, behind the potato?" to me implies that Parson doesn't look like a threat. It is a sarcastic comment on the potential ranking of the list of dangerous things in Erfworld, i.e. "What, the most dangerous thing after a potato?"

What if potatoes are really dangerous on Erfworld? I mean, marbits are just candy for kids on Earth.

I would have to say that potatoes are the most dangerous thing on both worlds: two words: French Fries

[Kelon]

Has anyone considered that Parson still owes Charley several calcuations? And that he might have called Parson?

Kelon

[The Black Hand]

Has anyone considered that Parson still owes Charley several calcuations? And that he might have called Parson?

Kelon

That . . . that's an interesting speculation.

And yes, I think it might well be a possibility - though what Charlie asked Parson to calculate (if indeed, he did spend a calculation or three), well . . . we may never know.

[Kelon]

Well, what i was thinking was: Charley could have called in a calculation from Parson. The odds as Parson said has a decent chance of victory, though at a very heavy cost. Lets call it 50-50. After the last time Parson gave near 50-50 odds of winning (vs Ansom), and considering he blew up the city... and a massive army... and gained that army.... I'm sure Charley is very worried about what Parson is up to this time even if he doesnt know exactly what he plans.

It also occurred to me that Jetsone may be the last road block that could actually stop Parson & Co. for a good while.

Consider:
Royal Crown Coalition II, along with Transylvito, Unaroyal, FoxMUD, Hobbittm, Sofa King, Hyatt (which was technically a Regency, but committed to preserving Royal supremacy), and "Faq" and Haggar

So Transylvito is occupied with its neighbors, Unaroyal has been wiped out, Faq is considered somewhat of a oddball at best, and a good chunk of Haggars standing army was taken out fighting the land group (which was only there to help mask the force and to hold the city after the dragons took it out). While we dont know about the others, that they couldnt send help to defend Jetstones capital in their direst hours speaks alot about their current capablities....

Also looking back on some of the summer posts, I realized that if he still has 600 archons to support ( it would cost Charley 300k to 120k a turn to support them depending on level) and that the spell to get the prefect warlord costed 500k w/ casting support means..... not sure but ill think of something

Kelon

[Goshen]

Still, I would guess Charlie has footage of Parson "surrendering" to Ansom, and this would get Trem to back off the parley. After all, his bonuses probably provide Jetstone a sizable boost at present, and he would have to be Parson's number 2 target after Slately himself.

Tramm could just offer to parley via thinkamancer. And he might not believe Charlie's "footage", even though we know it's true.

Also, it's dangerous for Charlie to use those calculations Parson owes him, because that gives Parson information on what Charlie cares about.

[gameboy1234]

I suspect that the image of Parson being projected is simply "recorded footage" or just a projection of Parson from Charlie's mind.

Yikes, that is a notion that I do not like at all! It is one thing to consider that Charlie can send data, etc, via thinkagram, as being analogous to our use of emails, skype, etc. The idea that Charlie uses his mind to project stuff opens up an entirely new can of worms and moves Charlie yet another step closer to 'demi-Titan' status.

OR....

Charlie's a Foolamancer.

What's different from all the images we are seeing now and Jack's casual use of images? And consider that Jack says that one of the talents of a Foolamancer is to be able to look and see truly. Does that sound like Charlie? It does to me.

I've been thinking about Thinkamancy only, but now the idea of Foolamancy, boosted by the Arkendish and also Thinkamancy, appeals to me. Charlie seems pretty tricksy, like you'd expect a Foolamancer to be. Charlie's seldom direct, and thinks in odd directions. The only thing's that really different is Charlie's mind wasn't cracked like Jack's was.

[Miklus II]

I doubt that Charlie would want to make known that he can intercept thinkagrams. Think to the reactions of, well, everyone knowing that he can spy on them .

I'm thinking that this IS Charlies big secret. I always assumed that he was listening in on the thinkagrams that the archons made (like the one between Jillian and Ansom), or at least that the archons would inform Charlie is something important was discussed.

If it becomes generally known, or even suspected, that Charlie can intercept thinkagrams, people will react poorly to it. It might destroy Charlies bizness. People would start to use codes or avoid thinkagrams altogether. You could use hats, like Jetstone did.

[Terah]

What if potatoes are really dangerous on Erfworld? I mean, marbits are just candy for kids on Earth.

Because ranked behind anything by definition wouldn't be the most dangerous.

Tramennis understands the potato as maximally dangerous. Faced with the inconceivable idea of something more dangerous Tramennis instead chose the comically unlikely "Charlie musta forgot the potato".

Yeah, or not. I think it's a nicely ambiguous multi-joke.

[Kelon]

Could potatoes just be a reference of a couch potatoe? Parson certainly was one before erfworld.

[spriteless]

Janis is with Charlie. That is how he knew.

[robak]

Behind the potatoe is obviously a Monty Python reference to the killer bunny of doom.

[Oberon]

On another note, how did Charlie know Parson was promoted?

It has been well established that Charlie knows what he needs to know, has what powers he needs to have, does what he needs to do, and is what he needs to be, all in the service of the plot. If someone was needed to tell Traminnis that Parson had been promoted to CWL, and that this was a Really Bad Thing for Spacerock and indeed all of Erfworld, Charlie is the obvious and natural choice.

Im a little confused when Tremmanis says "right, so you dont know". I dont know what he is referring to by that statement, and I guess I am too slow to figure it out.

I believe that he is referring to knowing if Decrypted, especially his brothers, can be turned.

Charlie is scared of Parson because Charlie is SMART. Parson is incredibly inventive and perceptive and now GK is actually using his potential.

Charlie is scared of Parson because Parson has beaten Charlie at every turn, even while appearing to be outmatched the entire time. Remember, Charlie had a force of Archons sufficient to take the GK garrison in the GK airspace. And at the same time the RCC had sufficient forces to take GK. And not just one, but both sides arrayed against GK not only lost, but had their forces utterly destroyed. Worse than destroyed. They were later seen to be working for the presumed-to-be-swiftly-defeated Side... This is why Charlie is afraid of Parson. And rightly so.

Charlie has the power of plot. But Parson has the power of plot, justified. Charlie gets insta-appearing Archons, with new abilities any time they are needed. Parson has new abilities that aren't just thrown into the mix, they have so far been able to be justified by the Erfworld mechanics. Or they have been justified by a huge amount of limiting conditions, such as the volcano uncroaking showed. Examples of the former are the destruction of the siege, the rotation of troops in the garrison battle, and the Thriller dance fight. All of those are game mechanics oriented plot points. Examples of Charlie's brokenness are the instant-appearing Archons in the quantity needed, the "pep talk" which broke the thinkamancy spell on Jillian, and the DDR. All of those are ass-pull oriented plot points.

Not sure if Charlie can actually hear Thinkagrams. He has shown no indication that he knows the particulars of Parson's plan-- if he did, he would tell Tram, because Tram getting croaked is clearly antithetical to Charlie's best interests.

Erm, he has shown indications that he knows the particulars of Parson's plans, exactly as far as Parson has revealed it. Parson has only said, in response to Jack's information that Royals were certain to offer ridiculous parlay terms : "I do see an exploit here. But we need Wanda alive. It involves turning this battle into a food fight." This should be enough to make Charlie sweat, as he has seen Parson turn certain defeat into victory before. And it was said via Thinkagram, which Charlie can clearly (to me, at least) listen in on.

1) Charlie has cast some sort of suggestion or influence spell on him (Maggie warned that it was possible when Parson first contacted Charlie).

I'm not seeing this, as Tram becomes more resistant to Charlies ideas the longer the conversation continues.

As shmucker-conscious as Charlie is, I wonder why he's never popped warlords for administration. Unless archons have an administrator special.

My guess is that Warlords can be turned or can decide to "make a play for the throne", while Archons, prior to decrypting, can not be turned, and are so in love with Charlie that anything other than obeying him is unthinkable to them. And, Archons can have Leadership, of course, thus making it fairly much a no-brainer. Hell, Archons with Leadership can probably get the same reduction in costs that Warlords can when playing city administrator.

charlie has some years of magnificent bastard behind him, and now he isn't even able to stay verbally slick.
well, maybe it's just tactic.

Relax, and enjoy the Plot!

Heh, people in this topic have complained that Charlie is both too powerful and yet not powerful enough to deal with Tram.

His history shows that Charlie is able to pull whatever he wants whenever he wants. So votes in favor of Tram getting one over on Charlie are betting on the long shot.

Parson gets called a potato a lot:
http://www.erfworld.com/book-1-archive/?px=%2F018.jpg

[mutecebu]

Re: Foolamancy - we know that Archons can do foolamancy (remember DDR?). Personally, I think it's an archon projecting the images. Another possibility is that Charlie is linked with a foolamancer archon

[joosy]

IF we do see any action, it will be when SpaceRock makes peace with Gobwin Knob in order to try to recover Ossomer and they all all sit down to quince tarts. Unfortunately they are filled with sourmander jelly causing a kerfuffle in which Dollamancer Ace seizes initiative and dusts Sylvia with his Neon Explosive Rocket Firer. Alas.

"Alas"? You're becoming a fan of the Red One?

Or maybe not. But I think it's rather Tremennis who sports a Neon Explosive Rocket Firer.

We will never know what he has beneath his war skirt but I think you may have made a good guess.

[Magothys]

Behind the potatoe is obviously a Monty Python reference to the killer bunny of doom.

Seconded.

[Kelon]

To the money isssue....
Gobwin Knob had about 500k shumckers before they bought the spell. Gobwin Knob at that point is a single level 5 city with few living units to support. Charley also at that point only had one city... but the number of archons he has to support is massive. It would have bankrupted Knob in less than 5 turns. I figure the reason why Charley is helping the Coalition is because HE CANT afford to lose that many customers (as Gobwin Knob is unlikely to pick up the slack). This is also why he cant directly support the royals, as he has to keep at least some on merc duty (and spying as we have seen).

On another note, it would seem to me charley does indeed know about the ulitmate spell (as it has been said, he has good relations with the magic kingdom and would very likely have heard about it), so my question would be: why hasnt Charley attempted to get a similiar spell for himself? And where did Wanda hear about it? From what i can tell, none of the other sides have even heard of a five hundred thousand shumcker spell.. you would think the royal sides mages would have at least kept an ear out for what Wanda and Dirt man were doing in the kingdom. It makes you wonder if Charley didnt manavuer wanda into buying it ( for whatever reason)

[hajo]

Charlie describes Parson as "the more-than-perfect Warlord".
That implies that he knows of the summoning spell, and as far as I know, nobody in the story has mentioned that fact to him.
I think, this is a hint that he has learned it from one of the casters in the MK who was involved in the creation of that spell.

[zilfallon]

To the money isssue....
Gobwin Knob had about 500k shumckers before they bought the spell. Gobwin Knob at that point is a single level 5 city with few living units to support. Charley also at that point only had one city... but the number of archons he has to support is massive. It would have bankrupted Knob in less than 5 turns. I figure the reason why Charley is helping the Coalition is because HE CANT afford to lose that many customers (as Gobwin Knob is unlikely to pick up the slack). This is also why he cant directly support the royals, as he has to keep at least some on merc duty (and spying as we have seen).

On another note, it would seem to me charley does indeed know about the ulitmate spell (as it has been said, he has good relations with the magic kingdom and would very likely have heard about it), so my question would be: why hasnt Charley attempted to get a similiar spell for himself? And where did Wanda hear about it? From what i can tell, none of the other sides have even heard of a five hundred thousand shumcker spell.. you would think the royal sides mages would have at least kept an ear out for what Wanda and Dirt man were doing in the kingdom. It makes you wonder if Charley didnt manavuer wanda into buying it ( for whatever reason)

Wanda buying the spell before anyone else is a matter of initiative and wealth. Probably no other side had that much schmuckers to spend on a warlord. And most wealthy sides could be strong as well, and not in need of such a warlord. Charlie is in this category too. He is rich, but he doesn't need warlords, and he doesn't WANT them even if he needs. Of course, he has shown interest in Parson after he saw what he's capable, but remember, Charlie is an erfworlder (well, there's an argument about it, but i'm saying that he is an erfworlder , for the sake of my sentence) and what he thinks of a perfect warlord is a max level, dashing, strong warlord. That is the erfworlders sense of perfect warlord. And that is why Charlie defined Parson as "more than perfect warlord"
And GK? They were rich, but helpless, so they bought the spell. Also, don't forget about Sizemore's fame in MK. He was probably one of the first to hear about the spell. especially if that Predictamancer friend of Janis was involved in its creation.

[build6]

And most wealthy sides could be strong as well, and not in need of such a warlord. Charlie is in this category too. He is rich, but he doesn't need warlords, and he doesn't WANT them even if he needs.

true. Charlie is his own warlord, no? he makes all the "micro" decisions, not just the "macro" ones.