Book 2 – Page 41

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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby build6 » Tue Sep 21, 2010 10:27 pm

teratorn wrote:My guess is that anything made by someone who doesn't have the corresponding feat is treated as garbage at beginning of next turn and simply disappears.


makes a lot of sense :-)
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby Trine » Tue Sep 21, 2010 10:45 pm

I don't see charlie's knowledge of parson as warlord as an indication of his ability to spy on thinkagrams - there are all kinds of ways he could have that information. Basic reasoning from the change of the warlord bonus, sources in the magic kingdom (Janis and her mysterious friend know already at the very least)...
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby Oberon » Tue Sep 21, 2010 11:18 pm

Squishalot wrote:Base Warlord offensive value (or level, really) = Warlord leadership bonus. But if your offensive value is increased artificially due to some item, that typically wouldn't get passed on to your troops.
I won't argue the point, but I don't think we've seen anything which either supports or contradicts this theory.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby Squishalot » Wed Sep 22, 2010 1:03 am

Oberon wrote:
Squishalot wrote:Base Warlord offensive value (or level, really) = Warlord leadership bonus. But if your offensive value is increased artificially due to some item, that typically wouldn't get passed on to your troops.
I won't argue the point, but I don't think we've seen anything which either supports or contradicts this theory.

I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that it's supported by the fact that Archons can gain the Leadership special. To me, that would suggest that Leadership levels up separately from other abilities - presumably, a high level Archon who only just obtains the Leadership special won't be able to lead with as much bonus as an Archon who originally had the Leadership special from day 1.

Furthermore, Leadership is a special, it's not a base stat. Considering that offensive ability is increased due to things such as having CWL in your stack / hex, artifact bonus, etc., it would make sense that a Leadership bonus should be unique from offensive ability and improved separately (think HOMM, where Leadership and Combat are two separate skills). You could have an item that improved leadership-style bonuses (eg the Arkentools, irrespective of attunement), but a raw +2 offense sword shouldn't do anything to leadership at all, in principle.

http://www.erfworld.com/summer-update-2 ... mWanda.jpg

Ansom attacks at 33. Wanda gives 8 bonus to attack (ambiguous whether it includes Arkenplier bonus). Ansom gives 10 attack to his stack, leaving up to 15 to be accounted for. Presumably, his attack isn't linked to the bonus he gives others.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby Chit Rule Railroad » Wed Sep 22, 2010 2:01 am

Squishalot wrote:Base Warlord offensive value (or level, really) = Warlord leadership bonus. But if your offensive value is increased artificially due to some item, that typically wouldn't get passed on to your troops.


I think it's pretty clear that Combat and Leadership are separate. The linked box of Luckamancy Charms touts Parson's sword as "3 in 1" because it gives "Leadership! Combat! Ruthlessness!". (Which makes Parson's destruction of it all the more shocking as a violation of Duty - though perhaps he could tell that the Ruthlessness would drive him to find a way to betray Stanley and so Duty helped him throw the sword away.)
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby Squishalot » Wed Sep 22, 2010 2:52 am

Oh hum, I forgot that it was 3-in-1. Oops. The context of Oberon's comment was about combat bonuses, so I didn't consider that it offered a leadership bonus too.

Either way, yes, the offensive value is irrelevant to the leadership bonus. Warlord offense appears to be tied to the warlord level (Ansom = Level 10 = +10 attack, Parson = Level 2 = +2 attack).
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby Lamech » Wed Sep 22, 2010 7:36 am

teratorn wrote:My guess is that anything made by someone who doesn't have the corresponding feat is treated as garbage at beginning of next turn and simply disappears.
Very possible but he could just describe the process to a twoll. Probably something anyone would want to do anyway. Hmm... assuming I'm right this would make it really easy for the titans to limit stuff. Just keep fabrication from doing some stuff.

Furthermore, Leadership is a special, it's not a base stat. Considering that offensive ability is increased due to things such as having CWL in your stack / hex, artifact bonus, etc., it would make sense that a Leadership bonus should be unique from offensive ability and improved separately (think HOMM, where Leadership and Combat are two separate skills). You could have an item that improved leadership-style bonuses (eg the Arkentools, irrespective of attunement), but a raw +2 offense sword shouldn't do anything to leadership at all, in principle.
While combat is increased by all sorts of things I bet even armor and weapons affect it. Leadership seems harder to effect; I think about the only two things we know that affect it are dittomancy and the sword. Arkentools always get called artifact bonuses, which presumably are stack wide, but I don't think they increase leadership...(which really only matters if artifact bonuses don't stack.)
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby robak » Wed Sep 22, 2010 9:46 am

It is possible that leadership is a special in that it is a binary thing. either you have leadership (giving a bonus equal to your combat skill or your level) or you don't. The SoR then gives a bonus to Combat, it gives the Leadership special (enabling it) and making you ruthless (more ruthless).
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby Lamech » Wed Sep 22, 2010 2:53 pm

"Enabling" the leadership special would have been rather pointless though. Parson already got leadership (somehow) when he came to erfworld. He had a leadership bonus of two though, hence the conclusion that the SoR gave parson more leadership. Also its widely presumed that leadership is generally equal to your level. Ansom gives a +10 and is level 10. Parson gives a +2 and is level 2. Although, obviously certain things can change it (dittomancers).
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby TheDarkOne » Wed Sep 22, 2010 4:12 pm

Just something to note. if Charlie can hack thinkagrams he isn't every thinkagram being sent. When Jillian and Tram call they are both put on hold because Charlie is on another call. So yes Charlie may be able to hack thinkagrams but he obviously can only do one thing at a time so he would need to be anticipating it to do so, not just automatically know when one was in progress and intercept it.

Also keep in mind Charlie was completely dark while linked Vanna with no contact with his anchors. These seem to be clear indications that Charlie is not as powerful and Omniscience as some forum goers avidly proclaim him to be.

Also is anyone else noticing the similarity between the archons devotion to Charlie (someone they've never seen) and the decrypted devotion to Wanda?

Also super crazy random idea, maybe charlie hides his identity to he can walk around the magic kingdom freely. Parhaps he is really a predictamancer and not a thinkamancer, the same predictamancer who is yet unnamed but often referenced by Janis & Wanda. Dun Dun DUH!!
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby zilfallon » Wed Sep 22, 2010 4:36 pm

Not to ruin your fun, and I don't think that Charlie is an omnipotent undefeatable god of war either, but...
Being unable to directly talk with your units for 1 turn is not such a huge disadvantage, if you make preperations accordingly. Also, the reason why Charlie has only archons might be Arkendish increasing their loyalties. But I still don't think the archons are as fanatic as the decrypted.
Oh and, that super crazy random idea was mentioned before :D

And the blackout isn't something which should surprise us that much. If he acts as a master-class thinkamancer, i think it is natural. Can thinkamancers proceed thinkagrams, relay orders and such during a link? (This is really a question, i think they can't do so while linked, but there's a high chance i may be wrong since i don't remember where I got that idea)
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby John Campbell » Wed Sep 22, 2010 4:51 pm

Lamech wrote:Parson's watch is still working.

You keep saying this, but, on reading back through the actual archives, I don't see any evidence that it's actually true... until after Parson integrates his watch into his bracer and it becomes a very explicitly magical item.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby Lamech » Wed Sep 22, 2010 5:11 pm

He does how ever reference the combined item using magic from his world. If it was not working, that would mean that it couldn't be using Earth world magic, since it doesn't function.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby Chit Rule Railroad » Wed Sep 22, 2010 6:51 pm

zilfallon wrote:Can thinkamancers proceed thinkagrams, relay orders and such during a link?


Linked-up Maggie (though at the time she was presumably "the Thinkamancer") is shown sending Stanley a thinkagram to let him know that some spidews were croaked by Webinar's stack.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby paint » Thu Sep 23, 2010 2:26 am

John Campbell wrote:
Lamech wrote:Parson's watch is still working.

You keep saying this, but, on reading back through the actual archives, I don't see any evidence that it's actually true... until after Parson integrates his watch into his bracer and it becomes a very explicitly magical item.

you want to get UBER technical parson WASN"T WEARING HIS WATCH at the time he was plot'd inot ERF

http://www.erfworld.com/book-1-archive/?px=/016.jpg

got to the first comic you see his watch on his LEFT hand .
your going really good not even about to see his left hand until..
BOOM
4th panel clear view of his left hand no watch .

so ther IS no watch . ther for it is a magic item and not of our wold . created by natural thinkamancy . in parson head


http://www.erfworld.com/book-1-archive/?px=/018.jpg

then here 10th panel, watch is back ......but their was no watch .!!!

http://www.erfworld.com/book-1-archive/?px=/023.jpg
panel 6
watch is gone !!!
maybe the watch only appears when Pasron THINKS of it ..

http://www.erfworld.com/book-1-archive/?px=/024.jpg
panel 6 watch is gone !
remmeber left hand it was on his left hand earlier on the way to kinkos .

http://www.erfworld.com/book-1-archive/?px=/026.jpg
panel 3 watch si back ..

http://www.erfworld.com/book-1-archive/?px=/027.jpg

panel 4 ,
fat tired Parson has no watch ..

panel 6 , it's back ..

http://www.erfworld.com/book-1-archive/?px=/029.jpg

ah consitancy

http://www.erfworld.com/wp-content/uploads/book1/035.jpg

and gone again

panel 2

back in panel 3


http://www.erfworld.com/book-1-archive/?px=/037.jpg

on again off again
every other pane l

missing again

http://www.erfworld.com/book-1-archive/?px=/039.jpg


soooo my conculsion the watch hasa mind of it's own and like the matrix , ther is NO WATCH!!!!
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Re: Book 2 – Page 41

Postby Frogpop » Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:58 am

paint wrote:you want to get UBER technical parson WASN"T WEARING HIS WATCH at the time he was plot'd inot ERF

A stabber pops with his spear, a perfect warlord wouldn't be summoned without his nerdly watch / magic artifact.
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