Book 2 – Page 60

Page by page discussion of the comic.

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby Housellama » Mon May 09, 2011 2:03 pm

Shuuwki wrote:See, this right here? This is the kind of detail that drives me reading the whole of Book 2 looking for this guy, trying to piece together his motivations.


And this is why Rob is awesome.
"All warfare is based on deception" - Sun Tzu, Chapter 1, Line 18, The Art of War

"The principle of strategy is to know ten thousand things by having one thing." - Miyamoto Musashi, The Book of Earth, Go Rin No Sho
User avatar
Housellama
Tool + YOTD + Print 2 Draw 3 Supporter!
Tool + YOTD + Print 2 Draw 3 Supporter!
 
Posts: 499
Joined: Thu May 21, 2009 6:42 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby BLANDCorporatio » Mon May 09, 2011 2:24 pm

joosy wrote:
drachefly wrote:
joosy wrote:My hope was (is?) that Rob only elevated her so that he could cast her down and thus show the lowly, grovelling, unwashed heathen masses that HE was in charge, not us.


... but... she was something like second in command of RCC1 and was given a dramatic moment before her croaking. She was built up over a long time. When do you think the 'red' fanclub began catapulting her to prominence? Before or after this?


in the audio clip available to Tools there is a bit where Rob and Jamie are laughing over the life this background character had generated. The fans had named her, speculated on her role, etc. etc. She was intended to be a one off character but was written back in with a bigger role due to the fan attention.


That's available to Tools? An audio? Wow, I thought it was just a chat and lost forever. Gotta listen to it.

Anyway, irt. drachefly's question, well I can only answer for myself, but that rise to prominence was this page. Not that her previous appearances, usually barely surviving whatever nifty trap Parson had in mind, didn't play a part. But aye, that page 137 was awesome. If there was a previous moment, it was the page when she takes the pliers from Ansom's corpse.
The whole point of this is lost if you keep it a secret.
User avatar
BLANDCorporatio
Tool + YOTD Supporter!
Tool + YOTD Supporter!
 
Posts: 3446
Joined: Fri May 01, 2009 5:24 am

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby splexis » Mon May 09, 2011 2:51 pm

dirocyn wrote:George Harrison, the Beatle? Jeftichew the Carneymancer? Rasputin? Come on, people, surely there are better conspiracy theorists among you. It's so obvious, Jeftichew and George Harrison are merely new names that the immortal Rasputin adopted, in order to conceal his identity.


I don't see Rasputin. Rasputin's beard was much longer, down to his chest. Also he dressed differently than George Harrison on Magical Mystery Tour. Hmmm... scroll Magical Mystery Detour?
splexis
 
Posts: 64
Joined: Wed Feb 23, 2011 12:46 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby gameboy1234 » Mon May 09, 2011 3:09 pm

El_Chupacabra wrote:So... Are we going to have a "Time Bandits" moment where Parson goes into the "Wrong" Portal?


I don't think this will happen, but I do think that is what Charlie is going to attempt. Having Parson lost or captured would derail the current plot just way too much. I don't see how the story could support it. But Charlie could try, and be thwarted by GMtTA, and possibly Maggie and Sizemore too.
"Do it?" Dan, I'm not a Republic serial villain. Do you seriously think I'd explain my master-stroke if there remained the slightest chance of you affecting its outcome?

I did it thirty-five minutes ago.

Avatar hoarked from PS238.
User avatar
gameboy1234
YOTD Supporter!
YOTD Supporter!
 
Posts: 498
Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 10:04 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby Housellama » Mon May 09, 2011 3:28 pm

gameboy1234 wrote:
El_Chupacabra wrote:So... Are we going to have a "Time Bandits" moment where Parson goes into the "Wrong" Portal?


I don't think this will happen, but I do think that is what Charlie is going to attempt. Having Parson lost or captured would derail the current plot just way too much. I don't see how the story could support it. But Charlie could try, and be thwarted by GMtTA, and possibly Maggie and Sizemore too.


Oh, absolutely the complication going to fail, or at least go off course. The plot demands that things go a certain way. That's not the point of the speculation. The point is to figure out what the complication might be. That's the fun part! (well, for me at least)
"All warfare is based on deception" - Sun Tzu, Chapter 1, Line 18, The Art of War

"The principle of strategy is to know ten thousand things by having one thing." - Miyamoto Musashi, The Book of Earth, Go Rin No Sho
User avatar
Housellama
Tool + YOTD + Print 2 Draw 3 Supporter!
Tool + YOTD + Print 2 Draw 3 Supporter!
 
Posts: 499
Joined: Thu May 21, 2009 6:42 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby thaco4 » Mon May 09, 2011 5:14 pm

drachefly wrote:
thaco4 wrote:[equip=tinfoil_hat]Idea!! what if instead of going after Parson he is going to go through GK's portal and hit GK from the portal room. that scroll knocks out everyone in the portal room but the caster. Then goes for Stanley.End GK and everyone goes barbarian. Check sir.[unequip=tinfoil_hat]


Depending on the rules, GK may have an heir unit or two, though one has been captured and the other is kind of suicidal.


I'm pretty sure that a side has to either promote from within or pop a heir for them to be heir. I don't think you can capture a heir and turn them to your heir...

goodmorning wrote:But yes, very interesting point. He did say he wanted to croak a Tool, and this can only mean Wanda or Stanley. Perhaps he had a plan in motion for both? But for Charlie to think of Portal invading at the same time as Parson, and to put a plan in place that quickly... unless he saw Maggie's G-String, it's very unlikely. Just on the stretch of plausible.

So, he was trying to get Wanda croaked, and spent quite a lot of effort on Vanna to get it done, but that seems to have turned around on him. This could be Plan B to get Stanley. Jefti (if it is him) was sent into play only after Wanda and the dragons fell and decrypted, so he could have been contacted as soon as things went south to try the far riskier option of taking down Stanley.

It's possible.


Could be it was a contingency plan. Just in case Parson made a move through MK.
Sizemore has just said no-one attacks through MK because it's forbidden by convention. It's my belief that once one breaks this rule then they get a surprise reprisal from their portal room. MK has to do something to keep their neutrality. You break the peace of MK, MK croaks your ruler (side).

edit: spelling correction
Indeed
thaco4
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2009 1:21 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby Chit Rule Railroad » Mon May 09, 2011 6:37 pm

If Maggie is incapacitated by Suggestion backlash, the ThinkAlikers may Suggest Parson into taking a detour back to GK to retrieve her so that they can save her life. Alternatively, if Jetfichew lacks a coherent plan and just wants to hurt GK, they might be able to talk him into participating in a retrieval mission by giving him the impression that Maggie would not be returned to GK.

Edit to add: I realize Sizemore is there, but the last time a caster got incapacitated at GK (Wanda), Sizemore had a golem carry her. He may not be strong enough to carry her by himself.

If Maggie is croaked, the ThinkAlikers will have lost their direct influence over GK and may want to separate Parson from GK (while also keeping him out of Charlie's hands, which may or may not conflict with Jeftichew's intentions). I believe the ThinkAlikers wouldn't do anything Maggie wouldn't want; however, while that separation isn't something Maggie could ask for (due to Duty), it may be consistent with her desires for Parson. If she was unable to express what she really wants, that could explain why her message was ambiguous.
Last edited by Chit Rule Railroad on Mon May 09, 2011 7:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Chit Rule Railroad
YOTD + Erfabet Supporter!
YOTD + Erfabet Supporter!
 
Posts: 322
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2009 5:44 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby Feyrauth » Mon May 09, 2011 6:42 pm

thaco4 wrote:Sizemore has just said no-one attacks through MK because it's forbidden by convention. It's my belief that once one breaks this rule then they get a surprise reprisal from their portal room. MK has to do something to keep their neutrality. You break the peace of MK, MK croaks your ruler (side).


Pretty sure no-one has ever considered breaking that convention, so they wouldn't have a contingency.

"That... That would change everything," said Janis, in an awed whisper.

http://www.erfworld.com/page/6/
Feyrauth
 
Posts: 19
Joined: Fri May 06, 2011 9:25 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby dirocyn » Mon May 09, 2011 6:45 pm

And here let me re-state a theory from way back--it is possible that any unit can travel through the portals. Just that non-casters get croaked by the portal guards in the MK. If other units going through croak by operation of the portals themselves, there would be no need for guards. But the MK can't let that be known, or some side will send enough units to overwhelm the guards.
dirocyn
 
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon May 04, 2009 3:07 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby Feyrauth » Mon May 09, 2011 6:56 pm

President_Allosaurus wrote:I'm dissapointed more people haven't figured out who the random casters are. You guys are usually good at this.


Since the march of the GMTTA was 4 updates back, I assume you refer to the casters in this update. Assuming George Harrison is Jeftichew, that leaves Bowie the Changemancer and Spenser the Findamancer. It's been established that the Fairy Godmother is most likely a Changemancer, which I suppose leaves Hermione as the Findamancer. Just wondering *why* Hermione is a findamancer, and where the name comes from... on brief Wiki inspection, probably here.
Feyrauth
 
Posts: 19
Joined: Fri May 06, 2011 9:25 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby MarbitChow » Mon May 09, 2011 7:10 pm

thaco4 wrote:It's my belief that once one breaks this rule then they get a surprise reprisal from their portal room. MK has to do something to keep their neutrality. You break the peace of MK, MK croaks your ruler (side).

That would require that they had a Predictamancer know that Parson was going to come through in order to have the guy waiting at the GK portal. Predictamancers are supposed to be rare in the MK (since their side shouldn't normally fall), and while Marie knew that he was coming, I doubt that she'd share with too many others who were not like-minded, like Janis.

As a side note, I'm actually kinda hoping that the word to invoke the scroll he's got in his hand is "Checkov".
User avatar
MarbitChow
 
Posts: 2510
Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2009 5:41 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby cloudbreaker » Mon May 09, 2011 8:49 pm

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but has it been noted that Jeftichew/Harrison is wearing Unaroyal colors? Just more evidence pointing to him being one of Bea's former casters.
Bored? Read The Adventured of Melissa Ray. An Erfworld fanfic. comment here

Or A Tale From Traz. (Now complete!). comment here.
User avatar
cloudbreaker
 
Posts: 451
Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:09 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby Musrum » Mon May 09, 2011 9:47 pm

I'm liking the theory that Jeftichew is going to take down GK's portal.

For me that's a legitimate plan for Charlie to come up with, based on his imperfect information.

Charlie knows PGLH can enter the MK, so it would be a relatively easy to find some sympathetic casters (exUnaroyal) to setup a patrol on the GK portal, passing the scroll as a baton. Taking out the GK portal (assuming is can be done) is probably the lowest risk option (who knows what protections PGLH has up). It also achieves a strategic objective (isolate PGLH from GK) without assuming anything about the purpose of his visit.

The other thing it does is set us up for a dramatic Nostos.
Musrum
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2011 5:35 am

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby thaco4 » Mon May 09, 2011 10:22 pm

Musrum wrote:I'm liking the theory that Jeftichew is going to take down GK's portal.

For me that's a legitimate plan for Charlie to come up with, based on his imperfect information.

Charlie knows PGLH can enter the MK, so it would be a relatively easy to find some sympathetic casters (exUnaroyal) to setup a patrol on the GK portal, passing the scroll as a baton. Taking out the GK portal (assuming is can be done) is probably the lowest risk option (who knows what protections PGLH has up). It also achieves a strategic objective (isolate PGLH from GK) without assuming anything about the purpose of his visit.

The other thing it does is set us up for a dramatic Nostos.


The only counter I can think of is Stanley himself. Just might be the fire he needs to realize the Hammer's potential.
Indeed
thaco4
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2009 1:21 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby Sygerrik » Mon May 09, 2011 11:27 pm

cloudbreaker wrote:I'm not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but has it been noted that Jeftichew/Harrison is wearing Unaroyal colors? Just more evidence pointing to him being one of Bea's former casters.


No he's not. Unaroyal is red and orange. He's yellow and orange (and a bit white). No red at all.

Rereading this thread, I'm astonished at how quickly the speculation turned from "Is that Jeftichew?" to "That's definitely Jeftichew." It's probably not, based on a lot of factors, but most strongly the art. MK casters that are based on and named after a real person almost always closely resemble that person. Jeftichew is based on a specific real-world person, who this mystery man does not resemble. He looks like George Harrison, a completely different person. If it was Jeftichew it would actually look like him. He's a pretty distinctive looking guy, and a moustache and unkempt hair do not equate to the Dog-Faced Boy.

The two most reasonable explanations for that guy's presence are that he's an agent of the Great Minds or that he's an agent of Charlie's. Either is plausible and I don't think there's enough evidence to come down on one side or the other. Since Jeftichew can only work for Royal sides, him being J would preclude either option.
Sygerrik
 
Posts: 60
Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2009 1:07 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby Chit Rule Railroad » Tue May 10, 2011 1:33 am

There is no contradiction in Jeftichew's appearance being a reference to George Harrison.

Lloyd the Dittomancer's name is probably a reference to Lloyd Dobler, but his appearance is based on the Deadly Duplicator.

Sygerrik wrote:Rereading this thread, I'm astonished at how quickly the speculation turned from "Is that Jeftichew?" to "That's definitely Jeftichew." It's probably not, based on a lot of factors, but most strongly the art. MK casters that are based on and named after a real person almost always closely resemble that person.


Isaac looks like Carl Sagan, but his name is clearly a reference to Isaac Newton ("equal and opposite directions"). Does Janis really "closely resemble" Janis Joplin, Janis Ian, or Janice Rand?

How many cases are there of us knowing an MK caster's name and appearance? Besides the above, I'm aware of Marie and, most likely, Uhura (though her image is not detailed enough to be a close resemblance of anybody).
User avatar
Chit Rule Railroad
YOTD + Erfabet Supporter!
YOTD + Erfabet Supporter!
 
Posts: 322
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2009 5:44 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby vintermann » Tue May 10, 2011 5:12 am

Don't know why I haven't thought of this before, but wasn't it said that MK had posted guards by the portals? Isn't it possible that George/Jeftichef is simply that, a guard posted discreetly by the Gobwin Knob portal by the authorities of the Magic Kingdom?
User avatar
vintermann
YOTD + Erfabet Supporter!
YOTD + Erfabet Supporter!
 
Posts: 141
Joined: Tue May 10, 2011 5:01 am

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby Kyrt » Tue May 10, 2011 7:40 am

dirocyn wrote:And here let me re-state a theory from way back--it is possible that any unit can travel through the portals. Just that non-casters get croaked by the portal guards in the MK. If other units going through croak by operation of the portals themselves, there would be no need for guards. But the MK can't let that be known, or some side will send enough units to overwhelm the guards.


What guards?
Kyrt
YOTD + Print 2 Draw 3 Supporter!
YOTD + Print 2 Draw 3 Supporter!
 
Posts: 163
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 1:57 am

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby drachefly » Tue May 10, 2011 9:38 am

joosy wrote:in the audio clip available to Tools there is a bit where Rob and Jamie are laughing over the life this background character had generated. The fans had named her, speculated on her role, etc. etc. She was intended to be a one off character but was written back in with a bigger role due to the fan attention.


That's really odd, since rather than it being odd that she IS prominent, I'm more left wondering, "Whatever happened to Duke Nozzle and the other WL lost in the 4chan attack?" You'd think they'd be prominent too!
User avatar
drachefly
Print 2 Draw 3 Supporter!
Print 2 Draw 3 Supporter!
 
Posts: 1647
Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:36 pm

Re: Book 2 – Page 60

Postby ryanroyce » Tue May 10, 2011 10:02 am

Sygerrik wrote:
cloudbreaker wrote:I'm not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but has it been noted that Jeftichew/Harrison is wearing Unaroyal colors? Just more evidence pointing to him being one of Bea's former casters.


No he's not. Unaroyal is red and orange. He's yellow and orange (and a bit white). No red at all.

Rereading this thread, I'm astonished at how quickly the speculation turned from "Is that Jeftichew?" to "That's definitely Jeftichew." It's probably not, based on a lot of factors, but most strongly the art. MK casters that are based on and named after a real person almost always closely resemble that person. Jeftichew is based on a specific real-world person, who this mystery man does not resemble. He looks like George Harrison, a completely different person. If it was Jeftichew it would actually look like him. He's a pretty distinctive looking guy, and a moustache and unkempt hair do not equate to the Dog-Faced Boy.

The two most reasonable explanations for that guy's presence are that he's an agent of the Great Minds or that he's an agent of Charlie's. Either is plausible and I don't think there's enough evidence to come down on one side or the other. Since Jeftichew can only work for Royal sides, him being J would preclude either option.


I'd be astonished if he wasn't Jeftichew. Really, once I saw the pic of the real person, my opinion on the matter was sealed. This doesn't mean that he isn't also a reference to George Harrison, of course. Wouldn't be the first time.

As for the "Jeftichew can only work for Royal sides" point, it only counts as such if Charlie is actually paying him to do this. If Charlie pointed out to Jef that "hey, if you want to avenge Bea and Unaroyal, go hang out next to the GK portal. Oh, and take this scroll, too...", then Jef would be operating on his own and not actually working for Charlie. Knowing Charlie, this could be a favor-for-favor deal (a la Parson's mathamancy deal), where Charlie helps Jef get vengeance on GK (win for Charlie) and Jef owes Charlie some free castings later (also a win for Charlie). No Schmuckers involved, so likely still within the parameters of Bea's 'geas' on her former casters.
User avatar
ryanroyce
Erfabet + Print 2 Draw 3 Supporter!
Erfabet + Print 2 Draw 3 Supporter!
 
Posts: 66
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2010 10:58 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Reactions

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests