Whispri wrote:Citation? Read this update, the whole bit about war and evil.
I did. I don't agree with your conclusion. Cite and prove.
See also Sizemore's frequent moping
See his "BS rationalization." He has dealt with the issue.
[/quote]Beyond that, Courtiers are far cheaper to maintain than Warlords, they will always be better suited to peaceful tasks, even assuming no class bonuses related to them.[/quote]
As for Jillian being highish level, that just makes her an exceptionally expensive drain on the treasury, her out of hex bonus will be tiny or non-existent, if it even applies outside of fighting.
Level 7 in Episode 28, and word of the Titans confirmed that provides a +7 bonus. +4 bonus to her side. 1/2 a full stack bonus. Not tiny.
Jillian turns a profit. Proven by her existence after FAQ's fall. If you were right, she would have upkeeped herself to destruction before Book 1.
The only Units at Faq that/who might be considered layabouts are the Garrison Units.
They all are. No description of selling scrolls or other services. Foolamancer, Lookamancer, Predictamancer cannot create units, nor affect upkeep.
Oh and Jillian's beloved lifestyle will be much harder to maintain without the backing of a Capital Side. A Capital Side that Jillian is only partly responsible for funding, even before her Warband's Upkeep is considered.
Jillian's warband turns a profit. If it did not, she would not have survived FAQ's fall through to Book 1.
I'm faulting Jillian for being a villainous malefactor
She is doing as ordered, according to her Duty, Obedience, and Loyalty, and she abides by what passes for the Rules of War in Erfworld. It is not criminal, because there is no LAW that makes her actions illegal. She is not, by any standard of the definition, a "malefactor".
Further, on Earth, there is NO Rule of War against Mercenaries. So long as they abide by the Geneva Convention and the Rules of War, they are afforded Prisoner of War status when captured. That they are fighting for more money than a soldier in a nation's Army is not a consideration for their morality. So, no, not even by Earthly standards is Jillian a "malefactor". She is a Legal Combatant, by current US milspeak.
and for spitting on people whose strength isn't in their sword arms.
What strength? In a world where work is nonexistent and useless without the right Special, what "strength" could they possibly have? They sit around meditating and philosophizing. That really worked out well for Athens, didn't it? It wasn't Athens' armies that saved them from the Spartans and Persians... no, it was their philosophers that turned the Persians away at Marathon...
Her survival, while a blight on Erf, has nothing to do with that.
She's a merc. She fights for money. She doesn't start wars or strip neighbouring cities, like Transylvito. She doesn't annihilate Sides for the completely prejudicial reason that they are ruled by non-Royals. She hires out her sword arm to people at war. Haffaton wants to make use of her, after all. Did she ask them to start a war so she could have a job, or did Haffaton offer her a contract flat out? Latter, of course.
No, I think FAQ is the odd one out here, for being ashamed of the way the Titans made them. It makes no more sense for a unit to be ashamed of making money through war than for a lion to be ashamed of eating meat.
That puts the entire lie to your claim that FAQ supports Jillian. For this to be a "necessary evil" to be ashamed of, then the Courtiers must accept that Jillian is supporting them. If FAQ kept Jillian alive, then they would have nothing to be ashamed of, personally.
You can't have it both ways. Either Jillian is keeping the layabouts in FAQ alive through her profits and the layabouts need to be ashamed of her revenue keeping them alive, or they support her and have nothing to be ashamed of.
(BTW, I am not accepting that the Courtiers feel ashamed, only that you can only believe them to be ashamed in that case. In fact, they rationalize Jillian as a "necessary evil" and don't feel ashamed at all. People that are ashamed don't call things a "necessary evil." I'm never ashamed of having to do what's necessary to stay alive. You can take on that anxiety if you want to, but no thanks.)
No, it's the fault of the way that THEIR WHOLE BOOPIN WORLD works, that it's impossible or almost impossible to live at peace.
But you blame Jillian for it? That's totally prejudicial. The wars go on without her, so she's no more responsible for the fighting than I am.
I'm entirely sympathetic to Jillian's view that Banhammer is the one being the lunatic that can't seem to accept that fighting and war is what Erf is made for.
I haven't got a clue what you're trying to say in the last half of that sentence. Totally obfuscated.
Eh, it seems like sort of a weak distinction. Remember, people here don't *choose* their profession. They're popped for it. Jillian was created, knowing that her purpose in life was to croak enemies. And she was popped into a court that spent the whole time telling her that her very nature, what she was created to do, is evil.
And they died, but she lived. In the end, they were wrong, and she was right. It takes two to Tango, but only one to make War. The Side that chooses peace when the other chooses war is annihilated and the choice made moot.
That's not true though, is it? There are no end of peaceful ways for a Unit to support itself. Hunting, fishing, farming, mining,
Only works 100% for Natural Allies. Jillian made it clear in the Summer Updates that Units cannot reduce Upkeep to 0, so farming and fishing cannot support the entire upkeep of one unit. (Though there may be units with those as specials, like twolls fabrication, that allow specific types of Units to generate more than their own upkeep.) Mining for crystals is limited by location, but potentially very profitable, but only for tunneling units, and those sources dry up so only lasts for a limited time. Not every Unit can use every one of those options to reduce its upkeep, and even then, nothing reduces it to 0.
Not possible. Barbarian casters in the MK can undercut them and take that market, because they do nto have to generate the extra income to support other units. Fundamentally limited by supply and demand, and we do not know that there is a significant enough demand to generate income. We see some scrolls being made, but we only see scrolls sold by the MK.
or plundering Ruins
Requires conflict. Gotta kill the barbarians guarding the treasure.
And no, in the end, it's not enough. That is abundantly clear all through the text, in many places. Parson's efforts to figure out how to break the money system, for instance. Generating revenue is HARD and gets HARDER beyond a certain number of City Levels. You're trivializing it without knowing the details on the rules, when we know with absolute certainty these are only aids, not solutions.
And plenty of non-Capital Sides will manage the same (d'you think Janis ever fights for money?). Even Capital Sides, look at Future Era Gobwin Knob, they'll be swimming in money, fighting only in self defence or for their cause. Future Era Jetstone will manage to maintain a large army without a treasury.
GK has a massive treasury because:
1) Sizemore mined out the mountain.
2) When their living forces died, and GK lost all their cities, they had low upkeep and high income. In short, they had a large treasury because they couldn't spend it because they were being destroyed.
GK is not an example of a Side in stready-state support of itself.
Faq's an odd one. But not because they're caring.
At no time do they demonstrate caring. Buddhism is not a caring religion. It is a balanced religion, where it accepts both good and evil in equal measure as unavoidable. Banhammer does not help those in need, nor does he instruct Jillian how to select employers. Jillian chooses to fight to defend the weak wherever possible. Bh cares only about FAQ. Jillian chooses to fight for the underdog, and save the weak. Jillian is the one that cares for and protects the weak. Bh cares only about staying hidden and talking philosophy, which is fundamentally isolationist and by rejecting the world, demonstrates a lack of caring for it.
When other Sides march to war, they do it against their neighbours, sources of fear capable of destroying everything they hold dear.
Not according to what I've seen. Transylvito extorts from Carpool and other neighbours. Transylvito is the Side to fear. But even then, you're assigning one motive to all wars. There is no evidence that everyone fights because it fears a neighbour. The Side that is attacked in that case is fighting in self-defense. Are they evil for fighting back?
When Faq marches to war,
Mercenaries fight, but their Side does not "march to war." It's a term that requires the entire Side to gear for war, not a small expeditionary force.
they do it against Sides that have never heard of them and with whom they have no quarrel. They're the worst.
I reject that wholesale. You are applying Earthworld standards to Earfworlders that have no such concept. Mercenaries are accepted as a profession, and never vilified by anyone in the comic.
And it doesn't even jive with Earthworld standards. Mercenaries are not prohibited by any Treaties, and though unused by Western societies, are not considered vile or criminal if they abide by the Rules of War and Geneva Conventions.
Irrelevant. The state of the World has no impact whatsoever on Jillian's inability to stay sane after a few weeks spent without fighting. Plenty of Erfians have lived at peace for as long or longer without turning into Jillian.
Jillian isn't insane. She's bloodthirsty, like many others in Erfworld. And no one said she "turned into" Jillian. She was born Jillian.
Unless Jillian's murderous
Mercenary work is not by any definition "murder". Jillian does not kill off the battlefield. Killing on the battlefield does NOT fit the definition of murder, so long as it fits within the Rules of War, and Jillina is never shown violating that, even by our standards.
he can't be the man Jillian claims he is. Fact is, his system worked. His Kingdom fell because Wanda chose to break that system and reveal Faq to the outside World.
No one is the "man someone claims they are". No one sees all sides of an individual, and so you are always wrong when you judge someone.
Disliking war, does not require disliking the people who fight them for you, anymore than it prevents you from disliking other things more than you dislike war. Being someone whose job it is to fight in war, does not require you to be a Jillian. And speaking of Jillian, she was created to re-establish her Side if/when the worst happened. She didn't care about that purpose when the time came and had to be pressured into doing it.
No one is "required" to be anything, outside a law abiding citizen on Earth. But on Erf, things are different. There is Duty, Obedience, and Loyalty, which require you to be one thing or another, against your will.
But Jillian is not viewed as an aberrant personality type inside the context of Erfworld. In fact, she becomes the object of desire, not fear, of one of the most powerful Warlords around (more than one Warlord, actually). Jillian is viewed as uncouth, NOT insane. Her bloodthirstiness is NOT viewed as something to Fear, but a tool to use. Her presence is DESIRED, not avoided as an insane individual would be. It is firmly controlled off the battlefield, and so is NOT insanity, which would force her to action regardless of environment. Jillian's bloodthirstiness is a tool she controls and uses.