Digdoug - Episode 4

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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Sir Shadow » Tue Feb 11, 2014 6:17 pm

If it's a last gambit to hold out for reinforcements or win? You might have your dirtamancer leading your golems or shoring up a city
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Omnimancer » Tue Feb 11, 2014 6:43 pm

0beron wrote:Agreed Drache. Then it becomes a question of how common decapitation attacks are versus your traditional conquering. Since warfare and battlefronts seem to be the norm, I find it hard to believe sides get surprised and decapitated very often, but who knows? Because in a traditional war, the casters would generally have time to gradually retreat towards the capital as the side loses their territory.


Decapitation attacks are probably extremely rare. Jillian's plan to strike Haffaton required a powerful air force, a predictmancer & lookamancer to plan their route, and a foolamancer to hide their approach.

Of course, that's in the case of a very large side where you have to journey through enemy territory for a while to reach the capital. A smaller side's capital might not be far from the border and more vulnerable to a decapitation strike. It's probably tricky even then though, since that's a well defended spot, so you might have to weaken the side first through attrition.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Lilwik » Tue Feb 11, 2014 7:24 pm

0beron wrote:Even in a world that runs on turns, your casters should be able to retreat steadily provided you don't foolishly literally send them to the front lines.
It's not that foolish, since the places where fighting is most intense are often also the places where casters can do the most good, especially Healomancers and Naughtymancers. On the surface it seems like Digdoug was exactly where he needed to be in Weatherbug, and that's a front-line city that is expected to be attacked any turn. That's why he should have stayed there and made its defenses invincible as he was planning. I'm eager to see what's going through Posbrake's head, but I doubt he made the right decision in bringing Digdoug home from the front. I suspect that Posbrake has been compromised in some way.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Sir Shadow » Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:42 pm

Nah, given what we've seen about Prosbake's mind through the signamancy of the capital he designed, I imagine he's got a really good head on his shoulders.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Shai_hulud » Tue Feb 11, 2014 9:51 pm

Is it a head... of cabbage?
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Jacinth and Rubies » Tue Feb 11, 2014 10:59 pm

Shai_hulud wrote:Is it a head... of cabbage?


yes... and oddly enough, he can't seem to find himself a queen. Guy can't seem to catch a break. Stupid anti-brassicites. He had a terrible upbringing, too!
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Gorky » Tue Feb 11, 2014 11:59 pm

DolGrenn wrote:Prince Creen...

...genius. :D

I finally got Print Screen and Pause/Break. That's awesome.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Omnimancer » Wed Feb 12, 2014 10:39 am

Lilwik wrote:
0beron wrote:Even in a world that runs on turns, your casters should be able to retreat steadily provided you don't foolishly literally send them to the front lines.
It's not that foolish, since the places where fighting is most intense are often also the places where casters can do the most good, especially Healomancers and Naughtymancers. On the surface it seems like Digdoug was exactly where he needed to be in Weatherbug, and that's a front-line city that is expected to be attacked any turn. That's why he should have stayed there and made its defenses invincible as he was planning. I'm eager to see what's going through Posbrake's head, but I doubt he made the right decision in bringing Digdoug home from the front. I suspect that Posbrake has been compromised in some way.


Sending a caster to the front lines seems to be a high risk/high reward gambit. It's almost encouraged by erfworld's mechanics too, since casters give leadership bonuses to the unit types they created.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby kwotski » Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:12 am

bladestorm wrote:
Arky wrote:Oh, and could someone explain to me the joke in Chief Bucky Bits' name? I don't get it.

A bucky bit is a bit in a binary representation of a character that is set by pressing on a keyboard modifier key other than the shift key. So alt, control, meta, option, or command. Five out of the six keys depressed for the seal could represent these bucky bits. I expect at least one more of the modifier keys to be name-dropped before this story arc wraps up.


The Jargon File entry has a bit of historical info also: http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/B/bucky-bits.html

Check out the linked http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/S/space ... board.html !
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Not Me » Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:55 am

From the map of the Magic Kingdom we got in Book 1 it can be seen that it is divided in 8 sectors (I would guess one for each Magic Class, Hocus Pocus, Spookism, Stuffamancy, Eyemancy, Hippiemancy, Naughtymancy, Stagemancy, Clevermancy) plus Portal Park.
Almost every time we've seen Sizemore go to the MK it was either in the Hippiemancer sector or at Portal Park.
I guess the other sector (even if it was not specifically mentioned as such) that we've seen was the Eyemancy sector where Parson goes at the end of Book 2.
I would expect each caster that goes to hang out in the MK to go to their corresponding sector (or to Portal Park) and to be an entity similar to the Great Minds that Think Alike formed by Dirtamancers (and by all the other disciplines). Probably the Dirtamancer we saw in Portal Park to destroy Sizemore's pyramid is one of them.
Sizemore being the "philosophical type" and interested in other disciplines is supposed to be pretty rare so having someone hanging out in other sectors is probably not so common and him being a Dirtamancer probably comes pretty handy to the other disciplines so that's why he is so popular.
In the case of other (non-barbarian) Dirtamancers I would expect for them to use up their juice either upgrading cities or making golems. So Digdoug is probably young enough (the other option would be "not interested" enough but doesn't seems to be his case) that he had not much of a chance to go hang out in the MK.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby drachefly » Wed Feb 12, 2014 1:56 pm

0beron wrote:Agreed Drache. Then it becomes a question of how common decapitation attacks are versus your traditional conquering. Since warfare and battlefronts seem to be the norm, I find it hard to believe sides get surprised and decapitated very often, but who knows? Because in a traditional war, the casters would generally have time to gradually retreat towards the capital as the side loses their territory.


Actually, I meant that that explains why Dirtamancers attached to a side are rare in the MK, but it also helps with that.

Simply that they have a leadership bonus over a unit type almost explains why there aren't many survivors of fallen sides. How many such have we seen in the MK? How many dollamancers, croakamancers, OR dirtamancers? In final city defense, they will be towards the front lines, engaged in melee, and likely to go down with their stack.

Who have we seen in ample supply? Thinkamancers, and carnies. Hippies of various sorts. Flower Power probably does provide a bonus over plant types, but that isn't their main focus and may be often unsuited to city defense. I'd also expect to see moneymancers, turnamancers, hat magicians and such.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby oslecamo2_temp » Wed Feb 12, 2014 4:16 pm

drachefly wrote:Simply that they have a leadership bonus over a unit type almost explains why there aren't many survivors of fallen sides. How many such have we seen in the MK? How many dollamancers, croakamancers, OR dirtamancers? In final city defense, they will be towards the front lines, engaged in melee, and likely to go down with their stack.


That's an excellent point and I can't believe I hadn't tought about it earlier! Indeed, some mancers are much more suited to the frontline than others, and so their mortality rates will also be higher.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Lilwik » Wed Feb 12, 2014 4:50 pm

drachefly wrote:Flower Power probably does provide a bonus over plant types, but that isn't their main focus and may be often unsuited to city defense.
When it comes down to the end of your side and the battle to save your capital then city defense becomes the only priority. If Florists are surviving more than Dirtamancers even though they can both lead stacks, then I'd expect it to be because Flower Power has better defensive spells.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Mogster2 » Wed Feb 12, 2014 9:19 pm

bladestorm wrote:
Arky wrote:Oh, and could someone explain to me the joke in Chief Bucky Bits' name? I don't get it.

A bucky bit is a bit in a binary representation of a character that is set by pressing on a keyboard modifier key other than the shift key. So alt, control, meta, option, or command. Five out of the six keys depressed for the seal could represent these bucky bits. I expect at least one more of the modifier keys to be name-dropped before this story arc wraps up.

Interesting. I read it a completely different way. The name Bucky Bits immediately made me think of Buckminsterfullerenes, an unusual form of carbon having 60 atoms and resembling a soccer ball, which earned them the nickname "Bucky balls." However, taking into account that the Chief is female, and "bits" is slang for "chesticles"... you get the idea. ;)

(Or maybe I'm just a pervert. Could go either way, really.)
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Omnimancer » Thu Feb 13, 2014 7:39 pm

oslecamo2_temp wrote:
drachefly wrote:Simply that they have a leadership bonus over a unit type almost explains why there aren't many survivors of fallen sides. How many such have we seen in the MK? How many dollamancers, croakamancers, OR dirtamancers? In final city defense, they will be towards the front lines, engaged in melee, and likely to go down with their stack.


That's an excellent point and I can't believe I hadn't tought about it earlier! Indeed, some mancers are much more suited to the frontline than others, and so their mortality rates will also be higher.


Are there any casters that can't hold their own in a fight? They might all have some nasty tricks they can pull in battle.

For example, predictamancers can use gun-kata like magic to dodge attacks and target enemies. Lookamancers can blind people. Flower Power can force individual units to sit out turns. Perhaps all casters are handy on the front line in some way.

The ones that stick in the capitol might be those most useful for planning strategy and issuing commands, like thinkamancers and predictamancers. It's not that they can't kick ass leading a stack, it's just that the ruler wants them nearby.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Lilwik » Thu Feb 13, 2014 8:59 pm

Omnimancer wrote:Are there any casters that can't hold their own in a fight? They might all have some nasty tricks they can pull in battle.
We shouldn't expect casters to be able to fight. We've seen spells that can be used to attack, but that is only circumstantial evidence and we have some direct evidence available. I'm thinking of Book 2, Page 90, "And he's a warlord. Combat is his bag, not ours," and also Book 0, Episode 20, "The actual effect the new air defense spells might have on an enemy wasn't something she understood well. It was for a warlord to say how useful something might be in battle."

To me these sorts of things sound like Erfworlders consider fighting to be a matter for warlords and specifically not a matter for casters. Consider what happened to Orwell when he tried blinding Jillian in Book 0, Episode 63. It didn't go well for him.

So maybe every discipline has spells that can be used to attack, but it's not something I would expect from what we know about the division of responsibilities between casters and warlords.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby 0beron » Thu Feb 13, 2014 9:51 pm

Omnimancer wrote:Are there any casters that can't hold their own in a fight? They might all have some nasty tricks they can pull in battle.
Most of the time we have seen a caster in direct combat, they have actually kicked serious butt, though one should note they've always had prep time so far as I can recall. A few that come to mind:
  • Sizemore would have been a prime target during tBfGK but he didn't even take a single hit thanks to tunneling and the protection of his golems
  • Same goes for Wanda, she only ran into trouble during that battle when she took to the air with less support, and was attacked by (basically) another caster
  • Delphi shot down all those fliers over Goodminton
  • Every time Olive gets into combat like ever
  • Ace fights pretty darn well even without using magic
So if a caster anticipates that they will have to defend their city, then I expect many disciplines should be able to hold their own.
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There's gotta be a good joke in here somewhere.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Lipkin » Thu Feb 13, 2014 10:13 pm

Ace was not spending juice, but he was using magic. He was using items he created, so he was in his element. And then he did fight later with his own spells. He was unable to walk, and was still a huge threat, bad puns aside.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Omnimancer » Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:02 pm

0beron wrote:
Omnimancer wrote:Are there any casters that can't hold their own in a fight? They might all have some nasty tricks they can pull in battle.
Most of the time we have seen a caster in direct combat, they have actually kicked serious butt, though one should note they've always had prep time so far as I can recall. A few that come to mind:
  • Sizemore would have been a prime target during tBfGK but he didn't even take a single hit thanks to tunneling and the protection of his golems
  • Same goes for Wanda, she only ran into trouble during that battle when she took to the air with less support, and was attacked by (basically) another caster
  • Delphi shot down all those fliers over Goodminton
  • Every time Olive gets into combat like ever
  • Ace fights pretty darn well even without using magic
So if a caster anticipates that they will have to defend their city, then I expect many disciplines should be able to hold their own.


Aside from directly attacking themselves, many casters can buff/nerf/capture/confuse nearby units in ways that make them useful on the front lines.

A dittomancer duplicating arrows/units. A turnamancer bringing an enemy unit to your side. A healomancer curing the wounded. A foolamancer hiding your units and throwing illusions. Etc.
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Re: Digdoug - Episode 4

Postby Shai_hulud » Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:10 pm

Lipkin wrote:He was unable to walk, and was still a huge threat, bad puns aside.
I'd go so far as to say that despite the unbearable puns, it looked like he did some heavy damage.
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