Book 2 - Page 1

Page by page discussion of the comic.

Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Silophant » Fri Oct 30, 2009 12:39 am

Infidel wrote:mm, I'm liking that series, although, like xanth, sometimes the puns are a bit much. Right now I've halted my forward progress as
Spoiler: show
my favorite character, Rincewind, is apparently dead.


Spoiler: show
Have heart. He's alive and well in the latest book, Unseen Academicals.
Last edited by SteveMB on Fri Oct 30, 2009 11:04 am, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Added spoiler tag
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Darkside007 » Fri Oct 30, 2009 12:51 am

The room the Decrypted guards are in is pretty dark. Why are people complaining about the lack of individual shadows?

Also, the guards at Buckingham Palace are completely pointless too, the point is decoration, and keeping random units from wandering into important areas. (Like, I dunno, the command center)
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby fjolnir » Fri Oct 30, 2009 1:58 am

Majutsukai wrote:...Is that a triforce on Maggie's necklace? Or am I seeing things?

I'm pretty sure that's an All Seeing Eye, similar to the back of the one dollar bill, though I could be mistaken...
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Plasmabunny » Fri Oct 30, 2009 2:04 am

Hmmm, that logo on her neck looks a bit like the Steve Jackson games logo...

And wow, is Maggie foxy in this update.
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Sixty » Fri Oct 30, 2009 2:14 am

Updog wrote:The art style is so gloriously serious, Great work Xin!! I couldn't help but notice in panel 2 Stanley's flutters towards the door, presumably becuase he's on a parapet looking out across his capital, but as he walks through the door the cape is fluttering towards where he previously stood at pretty much a 90" angle, either Stanley uses speedhax to make his walk, or there's a natural thinkamancy at work that ensures that capes always flutter in the opposite direction that the wearer is walking
hahahaha


It works for Laharl!
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Mask » Fri Oct 30, 2009 2:21 am

Honestly, there's nothing wrong with the shading. Lack of shadows on the decrypted I read as there simply being very little directional light, but high ambience. Like in a shadow outdoors.

Dancing Cthulhu wrote:Plus there is always the problem of a unit turning. And like raphfrk said they do other things, like keep unauthorized units out of certain areas.


This is really the only practical reason to have a guard specifically at a door. Having guards at doors is a fine old tradition dating back to when paying someone with a weapon to stand in a place daily was cheaper even in the long run than installing a lock. And I guess it's a place as good as any to place them for having them on hand in case of spies* or rebellion. During a siege those guys would probably be up on the walls.

My guess is that those guys are "fortified" to use Civ language, and that's why they guard during their own turn. Units that will only defend and give up their move until ordered to do something else, so that the top knobs won't have to bother with giving them the same "Very good, carry on" order every turn. It would only seem natural to me that only some units, say a fourth, would be up on the walls scouting for enemies. The rest would probably just need to be "On Guard" somewhere.

Spoiler: show
Silophant wrote:
Infidel wrote:mm, I'm liking that series, although, like xanth, sometimes the puns are a bit much. Right now I've halted my forward progress as my favorite character, Rincewind, is apparently dead.


Have heart. He's alive and well in the latest book, Unseen Academicals.


Argh, whattahell. Spoilertags, both of you! :(

(Messages edited to add spoiler tags before anybody else stumbles on the spoiler --SteveMB)

-----------------------

edit:
*Maybe there's a charliesque spy-side run by a James or Jamie that has Bondsmen? It would be really interesting to see some sort of spy-mechanic in Erfworld, apart from units turning and Lookamancy. Perhaps you could send a spy to "work" a city during your turn. They'd activate on the enemies turn, during which it would have to stay hidden and gather what intel it could, and when it was your turn next you would have either some fresh info or you would have lost a spy.
Last edited by SteveMB on Fri Oct 30, 2009 11:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Added spoiler tag
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby DoctorJest » Fri Oct 30, 2009 2:37 am

Plasmabunny wrote:Hmmm, that logo on her neck looks a bit like the Steve Jackson games logo...


Which is the Illuminati symbol, aka the All Seeing Eye, aka the Masonic seal on the dollar bill.

And wow, is Maggie foxy in this update.


Erm, if you consider "undead Margret Thatcher" to be the same as "foxy" then I guess so.
:o
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Porthos » Fri Oct 30, 2009 2:43 am

This is from a bit further back, but what the hey. :)

Infidel wrote:Because omniscient narrators don't give opinions


The heck they can't.

Sure, 95% of the time they don't. Maybe even 99.9% of the time. But other times they do (usually in works that are heavy in subversions - or in works where the narrator/narration becomes a character in and of itself [omniscience notwithstanding]). The narrator in Rocky and Bullwinkle was clearly omniscient and he gave opinions all the time. So to do other works. A glance at the Narrator page over at TV Tropes will show a few omniscient narrators that give opinions on what they are describing.

And, of course, Wikipedia has something to say about this:

Third-person Narrative (Third person Omniscient)
In some unusual cases, the reliability and impartiality of the narrator may in fact be as suspect as in the third person limited.


Now I can't say for sure if this is the Narrator being a Deadpan Snarker, or if it's just Parson thinking about his day. It's probably the later. But let's not say that Omniscient Narrators have never had opinions before. Coz it just ain't true. ;)
Last edited by Porthos on Fri Oct 30, 2009 2:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby BillMcD » Fri Oct 30, 2009 2:45 am

Gez wrote:
Infidel wrote:Because omniscient narrators don't give opinions

They don't? Seems I have just found the new frontier of literature that will allow me to write a groundbreaking novel that'll be required reading in colleges the world over.

Anyway, it seems there's a confusion between omniscient narrator and heterodiegetic narrator. A narrator may very well be opinionated, misleading, non-omniscient, and still not a character in the story.



Right about then, the Duke boys was in for a heap o' trouble!
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Porthos » Fri Oct 30, 2009 2:48 am

BillMcD wrote:Right about then, the Duke boys was in for a heap o' trouble!


That was one of the narrators listed on the TV Tropes page, naturally. ;)
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Dancing Cthulhu » Fri Oct 30, 2009 3:14 am

Infidel wrote:
joneleth wrote:
Infidel wrote:Yes, but then the narrator is a character telling the story outside the story. Like Princes's Bride. The grandfather was reading from a book giving opinions here and there. Ergo, the Narrator was a character, whether inside or outside the story.


I was actually imagining the Discworld narrator when I read those lines :P


mm, I'm liking that series, although, like xanth, sometimes the puns are a bit much. Right now I've halted my forward progress as
Spoiler: show
my favorite character, Rincewind, is apparently dead.


Where are you up to?

DoctorJest wrote:Erm, if you consider "undead Margret Thatcher" to be the same as "foxy" then I guess so.


So current Maggie Thatcher then? It's a bit hard to tell sometimes ( 8-) )

Which is the Illuminati symbol, aka the All Seeing Eye, aka the Masonic seal on the dollar bill.


That's what I thought to. It's a nice touch, there is a lot of nifty detail in the art.

Mask wrote:edit:
*Maybe there's a charliesque spy-side run by a James or Jamie that has Bondsmen? It would be really interesting to see some sort of spy-mechanic in Erfworld, apart from units turning and Lookamancy. Perhaps you could send a spy to "work" a city during your turn. They'd activate on the enemies turn, during which it would have to stay hidden and gather what intel it could, and when it was your turn next you would have either some fresh info or you would have lost a spy.


It does seem like something that would work, I think infiltrators would be a great idea, and there are so many notable ones in popular culture. Reminds me of the spies in C&C Red Alert 2. Loved those little guys, forever loosing them to guard dogs though. Good times.
Last edited by SteveMB on Fri Oct 30, 2009 11:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Added spoiler tag
And so my time with the Tardy Elves draws to a close, and I am let to ponder how the experience will... eh, I'll finish later. No need to rush.
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Mask » Fri Oct 30, 2009 3:23 am

Dancing Cthulhu wrote:
Mask wrote:edit:
*Maybe there's a charliesque spy-side run by a James or Jamie that has Bondsmen? It would be really interesting to see some sort of spy-mechanic in Erfworld, apart from units turning and Lookamancy. Perhaps you could send a spy to "work" a city during your turn. They'd activate on the enemies turn, during which it would have to stay hidden and gather what intel it could, and when it was your turn next you would have either some fresh info or you would have lost a spy.


It does seem like something that would work, I think infiltrators would be a great idea, and there are so many notable ones in popular culture. Reminds me of the spies in C&C Red Alert 2. Loved those little guys, forever loosing them to guard dogs though. Good times.


In Civ 2 I used to end up playing Communistic industrial Spy states. I almost never went to war, I just produced cheap spies in my most productive city and had the rest set on the option that made all production shields into money. Then I just bribed my opponents cities and units, occasionaly poisoning a water supply or detonating a nuke to make a city easier to bribe. Then finish the sides bribery-immune capital with a swift coupe-de-grace using a their own units. Beautiful, and it would probably work in an Erfworld setting. :D
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby shneekeythelost » Fri Oct 30, 2009 4:12 am

Mask wrote:
Dancing Cthulhu wrote:
Mask wrote:edit:
*Maybe there's a charliesque spy-side run by a James or Jamie that has Bondsmen? It would be really interesting to see some sort of spy-mechanic in Erfworld, apart from units turning and Lookamancy. Perhaps you could send a spy to "work" a city during your turn. They'd activate on the enemies turn, during which it would have to stay hidden and gather what intel it could, and when it was your turn next you would have either some fresh info or you would have lost a spy.


It does seem like something that would work, I think infiltrators would be a great idea, and there are so many notable ones in popular culture. Reminds me of the spies in C&C Red Alert 2. Loved those little guys, forever loosing them to guard dogs though. Good times.


In Civ 2 I used to end up playing Communistic industrial Spy states. I almost never went to war, I just produced cheap spies in my most productive city and had the rest set on the option that made all production shields into money. Then I just bribed my opponents cities and units, occasionaly poisoning a water supply or detonating a nuke to make a city easier to bribe. Then finish the sides bribery-immune capital with a swift coupe-de-grace using a their own units. Beautiful, and it would probably work in an Erfworld setting. :D


I would do something similar, only with Democracy (NO corruption), since being at peace negates the only real drawback to Democracy (senate forces you to take a treaty). Of course, once I teched out, I'd switch to Fundi, and let the cash roll in! Plus the ability to mass for taking out diplo-immune sides without taking rather steep penalties was pretty handy, as it let me spread out my massing over many more turns.

Civ 3 made it almost impossible, because every nation got Democracy as soon as they could, regardless of what they 'should' have had. In fact, it almost made the 'mini-wonder' to use Espionage worthless unless you rushed for it, AND had a whole heaping pile of cash to spam cities until they were bribed.
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Sixty » Fri Oct 30, 2009 5:34 am

Another question I meant to ask a while ago but forgot until seeing Stanley next to some pikers/stabbers. If he was a regular unit at one point, how come he is so much smaller compared to them? It's like signamancy screwed him over (though he was still the same size back when he was warlord).
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Gez » Fri Oct 30, 2009 6:57 am

Infidel wrote:Yes, but then the narrator is a character telling the story outside the story. Like Princes's Bride. The grandfather was reading from a book giving opinions here and there. Ergo, the opinionated Narrator was a character, whether inside or outside the story.

Have you read, for example, The Strange Case of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde? You've got the classic third-person, heterodiegetic narrator. He's very opinionated -- there's a lot of telling in addition to the showing. Does it put the narrator in the story, though? No. While the narration is focused mostly on the character of Mr. Utterson, the narrator is not Utterson.
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Mask » Fri Oct 30, 2009 7:03 am

Sixty wrote:Another question I meant to ask a while ago but forgot until seeing Stanley next to some pikers/stabbers. If he was a regular unit at one point, how come he is so much smaller compared to them? It's like signamancy screwed him over (though he was still the same size back when he was warlord).


The "plaid" tribe might very well be shorter. Those decrypted are Unaroyal and Jetstone troops, after all.

Then again, the "Short despot" thing is pretty much a running gag in our culture. Napoleon, for example, wasn't acctually very short, 170 cm (5 ft 7 inch) which was pretty average for the time. It started out as some confusion about the diffrence between the french and british inch and stuck because it was funnier than the truth.

So it's entirely possible that Stanley is in fact short even for his own unit type and tribe, just because it's funnier that way.
Last edited by Mask on Fri Oct 30, 2009 9:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby HandofShadows » Fri Oct 30, 2009 9:16 am

Great first page and hope to see more soon. Wonder if the flower on the skull is a Greatful Dead reference?
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby fehler » Fri Oct 30, 2009 9:20 am

Two Forrest Gump references in the same webcomic? I disagree.
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby fjolnir » Fri Oct 30, 2009 10:43 am

Could the "oh dear" be the battle NOT starting and instead Ansom is asked to meet with his father and brother in spacerock?
That could be behind the whole "Meet the Jetstones" title...


Also according to wikipedia, the All Seeing Eye in reference to freemasonry appears to start a full 8 years AFTER the great seal of the United States (which is represented on the back of the $1 bill) was created...
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Re: Book 2 - Page 1

Postby Lothmar » Fri Oct 30, 2009 11:12 am

lol 'meet the jetstones' XD
Also it feels a bit different but I enjoy the new artist. ^^
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