The Battle for {Insert Name Here} - South Wing

by **WaterMonkey314** » Wed Sep 15, 2010 1:05 pm

My forces:

Spoiler: show

Decrypted ORLY - A pigeon... magically decrypted through Wanda's power.
Decrypted Archer - Due to budgetary concerns, these archers are really decrypted infantry with rocks and the archery special.
Dwagon - The signature GB unit. Plush, cuddly, and deadly.
Decrypted Heavy Archer - An actual archer!
Decrypted Diwigible - It is unclear exactly when and how Wanda managed to decrypt these, but they are fearsome leviathans in battle. (Though very poorly defended, due to the fact they're pretty much giant flying bags of air)

Albewt - A generic GB warlord who is an actual archer.

by **BLANDCorporatio** » Wed Sep 15, 2010 4:01 pm

Diwigibles! YAY!

Now if only they appeared in World of Erfcraft as well *keeps fingers crossed*!

Ok, the unit reference. If you're new players to TBfGB (spin-offs), it's a table containing the stats for all unit types in the game, as well as information on the Warlords, for all sides. It's purpose is to ease planning, by allowing you a quick glance over what units can do, without having to dig for them who knows where. The Unit Ref should appear in a post on every page in this thread, and I'll probably be the one maintaining it. So here goes:

Spoiler: show

Code: Select all: Gobwin Knob units Ground Infantry Name Hits Attack Defense Move Special Cost ================================================================================================== Ground Archers Name Hits Attack Defense Move Special Cost ================================================================================================== Decrypted Archer 5 1 5 1 Ranged 12 Decrypted Heavy Archer 5 10 5 1 Ranged 30 Flying Infantry Name Hits Attack Defense Move Special Cost ================================================================================================== Decrypted ORLY 1 2 1 5 none 5 Dwagon 15 24 3 5 none 71 Ranged Fliers Name Hits Attack Defense Move Special Cost ================================================================================================== Decrypted Diwigible 100 86 0 5 Ranged 422 Commanders Name Hits Attack Defense Move Special Cost ================================================================================================== Albewt 5 10 5 1 L?, Ranged 50 MCC Units Scouts Name Hits Attack Defense Move Special Cost Side ================================================================================================== Kitteh 1 1 0 4 Scout 13 PRLC Dothwaki Fawcon 1 1 1 5 Scout 14 Dothwaki Horde Fwying Monkey 2 2 0 5 Scout 17 Evil Imaginationland Amblypygi 4 5 3 3 Scout 25 Archnida Ground Infantry Name Hits Attack Defense Move Special Cost Side ================================================================================================== Dothwaki Slave 1 1 0 2 none 2 Dothwaki Horde Acarina 2 4 1 3 none 8 Archnida Agelenidae 8 16 3 0 none 25 Archnida Scorpiones 10 16 4 1 none 30 Archnida Cwismas Cwitter 8 16 3 4 none 38 Evil Imaginationland Tarantula 20 14 3 2 none 45 Archnida LongCat 10 19 5 3 none 46 PRLC ManBeawPig 25 34 5 4 none 106 Evil Imaginationland Ground Archers Name Hits Attack Defense Move Special Cost Side ================================================================================================== Stowm Twooper 2 3 1 2 Ranged 9 Evil Imaginationland Dothwaki Wife 6 1 5 1 Ranged 12 Dothwaki Horde SniperCat 5 10 5 3 Ranged 35 PRLC Dothwaki Bwood Rider 6 12 0 4 Ranged 36 Dothwaki Horde Cheezburger 30 1 0 3 Ranged 47 PRLC LOLCatiusha 10 19 3 3 Ranged 60 PRLC Flying Infantry Name Hits Attack Defense Move Special Cost Side ================================================================================================== Ranged Fliers Name Hits Attack Defense Move Special Cost Side ================================================================================================== Commanders Name Hits Attack Defense Move Special Cost Side ================================================================================================== Commander Crabfist 4 5 3 3 L?, Scout 45 Archnida Fweddy Kwueger 6 12 5 4 L? 53 Evil Imaginationland Chairman Rofl Mao 5 10 5 3 L?, CW, 55 PRLC Ranged Khaw Dwogo 6 12 0 4 L?, Ranged 56 Dothwaki Horde Commander Pinser 10 16 4 1 L? 60 Archnida

And the pop point allocation history is currently empty.

Notice a few, shall we say, irregularities. Fweddy Krueger is not a commander version of any of Evil Imaginationland's troops; Commander Pinser has 10HP as opposed to the regular maximum of 6.

HOWEVER, Fweddy Krueger is the fifth unit of Evil Imaginationland's roster. We'll just imagine that the fifth unit exists, and FK is a commander version of that.

Also, the 6HP limit was referring to humanoid commanders, which the Archnida are not. I understand the purpose of the rules (to prevent a certain Commander Shoggoth from rearing its ugly head, for one), but a mere 10HP for a commander maybe is acceptable, pending GM decision.

If anyone notices discrepancies, errors etc, please tell me and I'll update this.

Another mention, all commanders will stay on the list, even after croaking. Fallen heroes live on in legends.

And seeing as how the enemy fields Diwigibles, we WILL have some legendary fights on our hands. Coupled with the fact that we have few fliers, it will make for some very interesting maneuvers.

Put it this way. The Battle for Gobwin Bump version 2 started because the Diwigible, a unit from the Battle for Gobwin Bump 1, proved effectively immortal. Just so you know what we're up against.

by **BLANDCorporatio** » Wed Sep 15, 2010 4:15 pm

On the plus side, we have loads of options for territory denial- meaning, cheap units that we can place, all by their lonesome, in empty hexes. They'll die at the first enemy attack of course, but they'll put some stop to fast maneuvering. It's one of the few chances we have, because that Diwigible thing will NOT go down unless epic* firepower is unleashed upon it.

There may well be two Diwigibles airborne the moment we start (though, they won't be near our base, cause you know, game over).

*: "epic" is an overused word. But when facing a monster that has four times the hits of your strongest unit, can pelt stuff from a distance, and will regenerate fully on the next morning even from one hitpoint left it begins to apply.

EDIT: and for added irony I know just the warlord to pilot that decrypted Diwigible. No, not Graf Zeppellin; do that without my consent and I will murderate you. Another warlord.

by **Sihoiba** » Wed Sep 15, 2010 4:19 pm

One mistake Khaw Dwogo is ranged. (Also for those who don't know the Dothwaki are inspired by the Dothraki from George R R Martins Song of Ice and Fire series - except rather than being mounted archers, I think of them more as centaurs...)

I think there's only one decent approach to dealing with Diwigible's, advance war tactics, surround it with hexes of Dothwaki swaves and it won't be able to do more than kill one around... Assuming we can trap it of course.

by **BLANDCorporatio** » Wed Sep 15, 2010 4:23 pm

Ah, yes, forgot about that. Fixing ...

by **Sihoiba** » Wed Sep 15, 2010 4:30 pm

Query

4. Hits are related to size. So a unit with 1 hit is tiny (like a bat or bird), 3 is small (like a Gobwin), 5 is average (like a Human or Elf), 10 is big (Horse or Twoll), 20 is large (Dwagon or Golem), 30 is huge (Giants, etc). A unit may not have more than 30 hits.

Because I still have a fifth unit slot...

by **BLANDCorporatio** » Wed Sep 15, 2010 4:33 pm

If you can go above 30HP, please don't chuck them into a 200HP unit or anything like that. There's more interesting ways to deal with this than racing to field a 1000HP unit.

EDIT: I can't resist anymore. What does the scout say about its hitpoint level?

IT'S OVER 9000!

I'm so sorry.

by **HerbieRai** » Wed Sep 15, 2010 6:38 pm

Just wanted to add a few things:

First, ManBearPig can be used as a mount by 12 hits of dudes each, and Cwismas Cwitters can carry 4 to help get horde units to the front.

If you think we can take a dirigible out, we should do it as quick as possible with a massive stack of our strongest units, before it hits one of our important stacks. If we want to try this, we should try to make a massive "column" all in one hex to keep our strong units near eachother, then march on the craft as soon as sited. Otherwise the horde idea should work well.

Also, storm twoopers can help defend a hex with a lot of stacks from attackers since their cheap range and have to be attacked first.

The fweddy kwugar issue: I had no units that were "humanoid size", and so I made one. If I create other commanders They'll be different names, but the same stats as fweddy.

Couple more questions for yall:
1) If you have a stack of 16 melee attacking enemy range, the enemy gets their attacks first. They kill 8 dudes, would the remaining 8 attack, or would their attacks be ignored since the first 8 were killed?

2) I mount some slow dudes (move 2) on fliers (move 5), move 5 hexes, then dismount the slow dudes. Can they still move their 2, or is their move "used" during the mounts move?

by **Nihila** » Wed Sep 15, 2010 7:37 pm

HerbieRai wrote:1) If you have a stack of 16 melee attacking enemy range, the enemy gets their attacks first. They kill 8 dudes, would the remaining 8 attack, or would their attacks be ignored since the first 8 were killed?I don't really know. It would make sense to use the remaining 8 to attack, but with BLAND's Cheezburgers, this will never become a problem, realistically.

2) I mount some slow dudes (move 2) on fliers (move 5), move 5 hexes, then dismount the slow dudes. Can they still move their 2, or is their move "used" during the mounts move?The slow units can use their full move. Further research:http://www.erfworld.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=1317&start=380#p34323--The Great March

Okay, as usual, red is me.

Remember, this is WaterMonkey's game, so my word is not final. I just happen to have a bit of free time now, so I'll try to help.

by **WaterMonkey314** » Wed Sep 15, 2010 9:12 pm

Nihila is right.

Re: The 10hp Commander - I'm fine with this as there is a reasonable in-char explanation and he doesn't seem OP. A Commander Decrypted Diwigible? Nope.

BLAND, who do you want to pilot the Diwigibles? I'll rename my warlords if needed. Anyway, I'm glad you guys don't think the Diwigible is too OPd.

by **BLANDCorporatio** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 4:56 am

Well, you know. A certain level 5 (I think, at the time) warlord. That warlord.

Over there ---->

EDIT:

About HerbieRai's question nr. 1.

The remainder of the infantry stack deals damage. The idea is that ranged vs. melee combat goes like this: ranged pelts the melee units from afar. Some of those may croak, but a stack is a stack, one dies, all remaining move one spot up. Then, what's left of the infantry stack deals damage to the ranged units. And that's it.

by **Sihoiba** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 5:41 am

The problem with the Diwigible is it can carry other units. I think the 30HP unit cap is important really.

Scout wise I think we should have enough to be able to cover almost every hex within five hexes of the base camp.

6 scouts with a move of 5, 2 scouts with a move of 4. My suggested scout orders:

Kitteh 1: J10 - F10
Kitteh 2: J10 - J6
Monkey 1: J10, I9, h9, G9, F9, E8
Monkey 2: J10, I9, H9, G8, F8, E7
Monkey 3: J10, I9, I8, H8, G7, F7
Fawcon 1: J10, I9, h9, G9, F10, E9
Fawcon 2: J10, I9, I8, I7, H7, G6
Fawcon 3: J10, I9, I8, I7. I6, H6

Leaving E10, I5, J5 as scouts we could potentially scout but don't have units to reach

by **Crovius** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 11:44 am

Don't forget, Crabfist and his 4 Amblypygi are all scouts

by **Sihoiba** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 12:29 pm

Crovius wrote:Don't forget, Crabfist and his 4 Amblypygi are all scouts

With only three move they can't actually reach anywhere the other scouts don't have to pass through to reach hexes further away. So there's no point them doing any scouting.

by **BLANDCorporatio** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 4:39 pm

I've got no problem with the scout orders as suggested by Sihoiba, and we can consider them official.

I've got an inchoate problem with policy. Too tired today to rant coherently today, will do so tomorrow, maybe, after some postings from y'all.

The topic, so as not to leave anyone guessing, is orders, delivering, and officializing them. I feel that TBfGB 2 had, especially at the latter stages, a problem of having several official players, out of which three provided actual input at any one time. "But BLAND, we're just four players, it should be ok!"

Yes, we're just four players. And you better play. I'm not going to decide for you. Even though I may voice (OOC) that bad ideas are floating about, I will not insist on a policy of me officialising scout or troop movements.

Your troops are yours. Use common sense and tactical wisdom when ordering them around, think what would most help the others (assuming they are clever). Just order them around.

We stand united. One's mistakes or brilliance impact us all. But one is the primary owner of their mistakes and brilliance.

Oh, and have fun!

by **Sihoiba** » Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:22 pm

Bland perhaps time to end scout phase in big bold letters?

by **BLANDCorporatio** » Sun Sep 19, 2010 9:20 pm

By all means.

End Scout phase

by **WaterMonkey314** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 10:58 pm

Map:

Forces:

E8: "Alpha Team"
Diwigible
{5 x Heavy archer}
{Commander Albewt}

H6: "Beta Team"
Diwigible
{1 x Heavy Archer}
Dwagon
4 x ORLY

G8, G9, G10, H8, I7, J7: 1 x ORLY

by **Sihoiba** » Tue Sep 21, 2010 5:17 am

[Still not happy about not using the 30HP unit limit, it was in there for good reason - it kind of defeats the point of these skirmishes which was a test of the unit cost calculation in comparison the the Gobwin Bump games]

My initial thoughts are if possible carry all of the slaves, and ideally the Dothwaki to I9, from there the Dothwaki Bwoodwiders can hit and run all the orlies and return to I9, then create a massive wall of Swaves to protect us from retaliatory attacks, I'm thinking 9 individual stacks of Swaves in each of H10, H9, I8, J8, (using 45 Swaves), and the 5 individual stacks of Swaves in each of G10, G9, G8, H8, I7, J7 i.e. in the stacks currently occupied by single Orlies(using the remaining 30).

With 14 units total remaining on GK's side they could at best clear a route to I9, with individual attacks, but not actually hit any stacks in I9.

So suggestions I'm sure it can be tweaked slightly to get more commanders XP, but I think with a 166 Attack, 5 move ranged stack (before stacking and warlord bonuses) I want any plan to involve us ending turn with as many of our units behind a 14 stack, 2 hex deep wall of Swaves.

Looking at the Commanders: Pinser with only one move and 10HP can't really do a hit and run, the only unit that can carry him is a Manbeawpig, and it wouldn't have sufficient move to return to I9. However Mao and Crabfist could be carried to I8, by a ManBeawpig, they could then each do a hit on an orlie and mark back to I9 with their own move, the ManBeawPig would also have enough move to return to I9.

Quick Force reference (numbers not stats):

Spoiler: show

NOTE: One thing with my plan in order to move all the swaves, and Khaw Dwogo, 3 Bwood Widers, Fweddy Kwueger to I9 and still have a ManBeawPig free to carry Crabist and Mao to I8, we'll need to work as one team. If you don't like this then well need to think of an other option, hopefully you can see the value of the Gweat Wall of Swaves and dusting all those orlies for XP (It's important for all the Orlies to die for the wall to work as intended).

Note 2: We have enough high hit units for the movement order I'd suggest.
1 ManBeawPig to carry Crabfist and Mao to I8
1 ManBeawPig to carry Khaw Dwogo and Fweddy Kwueger to I9
1 Cheesebuwger to carry 2 Bwoodwiders to I9.

75 Swaves taken to I9:
3 on ManBeawPig carrying Khaw Dwogo and Fweddy Kwueger
3 on CheeseBuwger
10 on the Tawantula
15 on the 5 remaining Bwoodwiders (14 of which dropped off at J9 so they can reach the required hex, before the Bwoodwiders carry on to I9)
15 on the 3 LongCats
25 on the 5 Scorpiones
4 on 1 of the Chwistmas Cwitters

At which point the orders would be for:
ManBeawPig carries Mao and Crabfist to I8
Mao attacks Orlie in H8 returns to I9
Crabfist attacks Orlie in I7 returns to I9
ManBeawPig carries Dwogo and Fweddy to I9
Dwogo attacks Orlie in G8 returns to I9.
Fweddy attacks Orlie in G9 returns to I9.
1 CheeseBuwger drops 1 BwoodWider at J9 before carrying on to I9
Bwoodwider at J9 attacks Orlie at J7 returns to J9
Bwoodwider at I9 attacks Orlie at G10 returns to I9
5 Bwoodwiders ->J9 drop off 14 Swaves -> I9 drop off remaining Swaves
All other units carrying Swaves move to I9.
All the Swaves move into to position
All remaining units stacks up at I9 and end turn

On that note Watermonkey can we have levels for the commanders please?

by **BLANDCorporatio** » Tue Sep 21, 2010 6:11 am

Oh wow, two Diwigibles already near the camp. And there's probably more of them somewhere, because none of those we see is piloted by You Know Who, right Watermonkey314?

Sihoiba's plan seems all right by me*, but does anyone have other suggestions? Let's leave one more day for any more comments.

*: you say Crabfist and Mao do a hit and run, or a regular attack, sustain retaliation, then return? This is how they'd get 1XP. Just to be clear.

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