A PbP Strategy Game for Erfworld

[LTDave]

Q: Who decides what is wounded? The attacker, the defender, The winner, The loser, the opposing player, or the units' player?
A: The units’ player chooses casualties.

Q: All units may move into Woods, but Fliers may not fight. Does this mean they cannot fight and thus cannot receive wounds or that their CP drops to 0?
A: Their CP drops to 0. They may still be taken as casualties.

Q: Do they still grant their tactical bonus if you have more?
A: No.

Q: Shouldn't they be able to engage other fliers over a forest hex?
A: Logically, yes. But for the purposes of this game, no. Why? Because it adds a level of complexity, but without requiring there to be two combats in the one hex.
Does it make complete sense? No. But it should make things interesting.

Q: "The number of units inside the city is multiplied by the level of the City for combat purposes." Does this effect combat bonuses? Does 1 Flyer count as 3 in a level 3 city for combat bonus?
A: No. The spreadsheet does not multiply by city level for combat bonuses. If it did, it would be really hard to capture cities, which would ultimately be quite dull.

Q: Are units considered multiplied by City Defense for inflicting hits?
A: Yes.

Q: When receiving hits as the defender of a level 4 city, does it take 4 hits to kill a unit, since one unit counts as 4, or 1 because it is still only one unit despite being worth 4 for combat purposes?
A: The second one. A unit only ever takes 1 hit. So it could be possible for a defender of a city to WIN the battle, but lose all their units. It’s still a win, but the city is vulnerable the next turn.


Q: Extra players?

A: By the way the map has been divided up, I cannot see any hexes suitable for other capitals. There are no open hexes that are not outside 3 hexes of another capital.

Well, that kind of stinks, and I apologise because I should have thought about that a bit better. A game with four players, when we have (at least) two players who want to play and have registered interest – stinks.

So, can I apologise, and ask if we can make changes to inconvenience two players further in order to allow 2 others to play?

1st – Hex e9 needs to stop being water, and become open.

2nd – Telva, can you move your Capital to e9 and redistribute your cities and forces? (if you’d prefer not to go to e9, please pick one of the other starting points to get going)

3rd – Crovius, can you place your Capital in i1 and redistribute your cities and forces?

This leaves a5 and i5 as suitable sites for Capitals for our two other players.

The two players are turbler (who has been in since the beginning, and very encouraging, etc, so I don’t want to see him (or her? Who can tell online?) left out) and Gee Fresh, who has joined in at my request. Gee Fresh has played in some of my other Forum Games, and will be able to give me some really good feedback.

I know that these arrangements, above, stink, but I’m going to ask for some patience as we get going.

Thanks folks.

[LTDave]

Hi all.

Just some thoughts on the A-Mancy stuff.

From previous games like this I've played, it's best if we develop A-Mancy things that take effect in our own turn, rather than other players turns.

For example, it's better to have a tech that works when I attack, rather than when I defend. That way I have to remember my own stuff, rather than other players' stuff.

Let's say I attack Telva, and forget that his infantry are +1 hit points in woods when defending against Cavalry. So I win the battle, but Telva posts and points out that I actually lost, and so I have to repost and retreat and reorganise, but by this time three days have gone past and the other players are annoyed and have to change their posts and so on and everyone gets angry and then someone says something silly and the whole thing goes in hyper-angry mode.

Best avoided, all that. This isn't a rule, but maybe it should be. It just makes life easier in the long run if A-Mancy techs are things that are positive to me in my turn, rather than positive to you in my turn.

Thoughts?

[Crovius]

Umm... Can't you just maybe extend the freggin map since this is the second time I'd have to redistribute everything? This map is tiny for 6 sides to play on. Hell, you saw the size of the table in Lord Stanley's war room, it's gfreggin huge! . Yes, it's showing the capital plus about 4 other cities, but look at all that space that they didn't have revealed! Our map is tiny as hell!

[Telva]

Tiny as hell works for figuring out the stupid, but hidden, bugs a system though. Combat is bountiful, as are types of hexes. to do battle in

If it were an actual game I would suggest we expand the map

E9 is now not water and I have moved, No biggy AFAIC. Especially since I complained about F8 being surrounded by water hexes.

d5 e6 and c5 are suitable for a capital.

a5 is not, if any player has a capital in e9 as I'd have a city right next to his no matter what.

[Crovius]

OMG fine... Here. I moved. And that's it, I'm not moving again. Now update the map.

My turn 0:
1. Deffinetly playing, boo-yah!
2. Empire: WoD
Ruler: White Wulf
Color: White
3. Capital (Requiem) I1
4. Level 3 (Forsaken) H2. Level 2 (Awakening) I2
5. 2 Units of Infantry (Ghouls) in I1, 1 unit of Infantry (Ghoul) in H2, I2 and I3, 1 Unit of Calvalry (Garuu) in H3
Ending Schmukers: 79

A-Mancy:
Vote for Wizz-a-mancy I vote it a 4
Telvabots I vote a 2
Rush I vote an 8

Proposal:

Cover-A-Mancy
Effect: Cities level 3 and higher count as forest terrain for the purpose of Flying units having their CP reduced to 0. If siege units reduce a cities level to 2 or lower than the city loses Cover-A-Mancy
Fluff: The strongest cities in WoD protect its troops from fliers with many arches and overhangs.

[Telva]

Sorry Crovious, next time it won't be so frustrating, I'll look at the map and mark out several maps worth of potential capital starting spots beforehand so that we can each choose a map and then a capital hex from the map.

Expanding the map may not have solved the problem anyway, or created more (such as desire to move)

In fact I can gen a bunch of different maps while I'm at it.

current Map will be updated when I get home, in 4 or so hours.

[turbler]

If I undewstand the situation correctly, we are going to use LTDaves combat rules?? That's what my A-Mancy will be for
1. playing(felt the need to restate, don't know quite know why... Thanks for making room for me Dave,Telva, Crovius, and... anyone else I forgot.)
2. Empire Name: Superbia
Leader Name: Turbler
Colour: Grey
3. Vices i5
4. Lvl 3 Vana h5
Lvl 2 Gloria h6
5. 1 unit of infantry (Gula) i5
1 unit of infantry h5
1 unit of infantry h6
1 unit of cavalry(Ira) i4
1 unit of cavalry g5
1 flying unit (Ava) g7
Remaining Shmuckers 67

A-Mancy Ratings
Cover-A-Mancy: 12
Leaf on the Wind: 28
Rush-A-Mancy: 42
Wizz-A-Mancy: 24

A-Mancy Proposal: Provisions
Effect: A player with the Provisions research completed pays 90% upkeep on their units (sum of all units' upkeep -10%)
Fluff: Learning to make use of the land, this side can send some provisions along with their units, meaning less rations to pop and less upkeep to pay.
EDIT: I thought it was avg ^2 too. Re-rating

[Daemonwelsh]

wow... I am going to have to pay 64 points to do rush?
kinda defeats the purpose... but oh well.

the cover-O-mancy is liked by me, ill vote a 2 on it.

and this IS a beta version of the game, so a small map may do better in showing bugs and what not.
and what are the rules for the creation of cities?

[Telva]

Okay, I thought I had posted where I had moved, but I can't find it.

Units are in the same place. Cities moved a bit.
Capital from d8 to e9
City lvl 2 from c7 to d8

Also, e6 is not a capital space, i was wrong. C5 and d5 are open capital spaces.

Also wow... I am going to have to pay 64 points to do rush?

it's the average of the ratings. You'll have to pay 7-8 ish. I rated it high simply because it was popping units outside the time units normally pop and outside of cities, even right next to other player's cities.

Cities can only be built if you have a unit in that hex and if there are no cities of other players adjacent to the hex.

[Daemonwelsh]

Okay, I thought I had posted where I had moved, but I can't find it.

Units are in the same place. Cities moved a bit.
Capital from d8 to e9
City lvl 2 from c7 to d8

Also, e6 is not a capital space, i was wrong. C5 and d5 are open capital spaces.

Also wow... I am going to have to pay 64 points to do rush?

it's the average of the ratings. You'll have to pay 7-8 ish. I rated it high simply because it was popping units outside the time units normally pop and outside of cities, even right next to other player's cities.

Cities can only be built if you have a unit in that hex and if there are no cities of other players adjacent to the hex.

Good to know on the cities, and I thought the a-mancy was the average squared... That's where I got 64 from. if its 8, then it seems really low. I would personally set it at a 15 instead...
that's just me though.

In fact, ill vote that. Rush: 15

EDIT: and is it possible to develop an a-mancy multiple times?
such as think-a-mancy?
EDIT 2: oh, and we can fit 1-2 players more, when are we starting?

I would say tomorrow, but that's hallows eve.
How about Monday. have each week be 1 turn. or every couple days.

[Telva]

Good to know on the cities, and I thought the a-mancy was the average squared... That's where I got 64 from. if its 8, then it seems really low. I would personally set it at a 15 instead...
that's just me though.

In fact, ill vote that. Rush: 15

I misremembered a rule?!?!? Blasphemy!If you even think I'm wrong you'll ...

Players have one week to give their opinion of the rating, which is then averaged between the players, and then Squared, and rounded up to the nearest whole number – this is the amount of A-Mancy points required to develop the Advance.

Heh heh. I guess this means I ought to re-rate everything >.> Good catch. My horrible, horrible bad. I'll go through the rules again so I can hopefully not miss another detail like this.

EDIT: and is it possible to develop an a-mancy multiple times?
such as think-a-mancy?

I would think that it should say in the descriptor whether or not you can. But I'm not Dave so ...

EDIT 2: oh, and we can fit 1-2 players more, when are we starting?
I would say tomorrow, but that's hallows eve.
How about Monday. have each week be 1 turn. or every couple days.

play begins on Monday Nov 2.

EDIT:
If I wasn't confusing, wrong, and wish washy enough I'd like to make an addendum.
I previously posted Leaf on the Wind, but now feel it unfair of me to change my A-mancy (even with the hex type change). I should have put more thought into it.

I apologize first for being mistaken and second for being ... me. Turbler I apologize, please rate telvaboats, but keep Leaf on the Wind in mind as it's going to be my turn 1 A-mancy proposal.

Wizz-a-mancy 3
Cover-A-Mancy 4
Rush 5
Provisions 2

[turbler]

ok, if it reeeally is squared for tech ratings, then I will rerate everything... again. If it isn't, my sign up post holds my ratings.
Wizz-A-Mancy: 4
Cover-A-Mancy: 4
Rush-A-Mancy: 7
Telvaboats: 2
Anyone like to guess the theme of my nation? Anyone at all?

[Telva]

ok, if it reeeally is squared for tech ratings, then I will rerate everything... again. If it isn't, my sign up post holds my ratings.
Wizz-A-Mancy: 4
Cover-A-Mancy: 4
Rush-A-Mancy: 7
Telvaboats: 2
Anyone like to guess the theme of my nation? Anyone at all?

Apologizing for being wrong is all I can do. Ver. 1.2 of the Rules says that it is average^2 then rounded up.
http://davergrounds.googlepages.com/home

I'm going to have to go with an Italian Mob.

[turbler]

not the mob, that was transylvito's bit ^_^". I don't see any reason for an apology... but either way, we're almost ready to get this show on the road =D.

[Telva]

not the mob, that was transylvito's bit ^_^". I don't see any reason for an apology... but either way, we're almost ready to get this show on the road =D.

I'm sure everyone is eager to start.

Personally I'd like to see a turn order (I'm not sure if Dave made a list of players or listed the turn order). To me the game would be chaotic if everyone moved according to who posted first.

Also, the guy who goes last is really in a bad spot under the current rules. Theoretically, had I gone with 6 Fliers, I could pop 3 more and knock out your side (luck be with me) first turn turbler. Going before you that is.

1 unit (infantry) *5 (capital) +1(tactical) =6
6(fliers) +3(tactical) = 9

Schmucker Math:
Gain 100s; 54s upkeep; left 46s
gain 100s; 30 to upgrade lvl 2 to a lvl 3; 81 Upkeep; left 35s (I'd probably create another lvl 2 city before moving my units)

EDIT: More questions for dave:

Do we capture cities or destroy them?
Does movement stop when we enter a hex that has an army? Or do we do combat in each hex that has an army as we move?

[Daemonwelsh]

I would actually like to call a vote on the ^2 rule. the average is fine with me, but I would prefer the other way of just find the average.

It makes certain a-mancies unreachable, which doesn't benefit game play. and no, I am not talking solely about my a-mancy. though think about it, it is cheaper to buy the ultimate warlord, than to get wizz-a-mancy with squared.

and how about this, we roll initiative to see who goes first, and make it clockwise from there. we roll initiative each turn, so no player is stuck going last each turn.

[turbler]

I just read LTDave's A-Mancy set, and I realised that his Wizz-A-Mancy and Math-A-Mancy are the same...

[Daemonwelsh]

I just read LTDave's A-Mancy set, and I realised that his Wizz-A-Mancy and Math-A-Mancy are the same...

thus we get more shmuckers

[Telva]

I believe the reason why dave announced wiz-a-mancy was because we had decided not to go with the "skill tree" route.

I would actually like to call a vote on the ^2 rule. The average is fine with me, but I would prefer the other way of just find the average.

I personally think rate 1-9; average of player's ratings*4; round up might be a good idea, at least for a map of a larger size.

With this system, with an average of x, it will takes until y turns later to complete development. That's assuming you have not had a chance to gain any per turn boni to A-mancy points.
1- 1 turn (worse)
2- 2 turns (same)
3- 3 turns (+1 turn from before)
4-4turns (same)
5-4 turns (better by a turn)
6-5 turns (3 turns less can easily make or break a strategy)
7-6 turns (what I just said)
8-7 turns (way better)
9-8 turns (OMG so much better)

On a larger scale map this, to me, seems reasonable. With the ^2 system an average of 8 before took 13 turns and an average of 7 took 9.

and how about this, we roll initiative to see who goes first, and make it clockwise from there. we roll initiative each turn, so no player is stuck going last each turn.

http://www.invisiblecastle.com/ ? 1d100 should be safe.

Also: map idea for second game

[LTDave]

Hey.

Q: Squaring the Developments? What's with that?
A: I've run a couple of forum games like this before, and teh squaring thing comes in really handy. Let's say that I propose a development that says "LTDave wins the Game as soon as this tech is discovered". If it was just a plain 1 - 9 averaged x 4, Everyone will vote 9, which means I have 9 turns to survive until I win the game. If one of the players is a good ally, they might vote 1, making it easier to win this way.
With the squared thing, if a tech seems really silly or too powerful, it can be put more safely out of reach - 17 turns into the future - which is still plausible.

Can I encourage us to try the current system for a few turns, and then if you still don't like it, vote to change it.

Q: Turn Order?
A: The problem with a set turn order is that life gets in the way. Let's say I move before crovius, but on the day I normally post my lolcat dies or the internet goes down, or the forum fails because everyone wants to see a new comic. Then everyone is delayed while I bury my lolcat and organise a new internet provider, etc.
Under the current system, you just go when you want, as long as 1. Everyone else has had a turn since you last had a turn, OR 2. at least six days have passed.

This means that if a player drops out or behind, the game just keeps on rolling.

Because you raise revenue etc at the beginning of your own turn, we'll find that a natural turn order emerges. There might be a disadvantage at moving last in the first few rounds, but after a while the last guy of this round is actually first in the next round, etc.

It's now Monday November 2 in Australia, so if GeeFresh doesn't post a starting point in the next few hours, I'll have my turn 1, jumping in before you folks in the states & Brazil.

Q: Do we capture cities or destroy them?
A: Capture. Cities remain at the same level as you captured them. I'm thinking of a "Pillage" rule, where you get gold out of a city you can't hold by reducing its level, but we'll see how the current rules go.

Q: Does movement stop when we enter a hex that has an army? Or do we do combat in each hex that has an army as we move?
A: Movement stops when enemies are encountered. Movement happens before combat, so do all movement, then do all combat.

Q: Did we earn gold and pay maintenance in turn 0?
A: Yeah, I'm acting as though we did, but I don't think that was clear anywhere. Assume that you start turn 1 with 100 S, less the maintenance of units from turn 0.


Thanks to Telva and crovius for moving cities, etc. Greatly appreciated.



Here are my ratings of your A-Mancy proposals:
TelvaBoats: 1
Provisions: 2
Rush: 3
Cover-A-Mancy: 3