Darkness Rising

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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby The Colonel » Wed Jul 11, 2012 5:12 am

I need a juice potion to do it, JUICE ME UP! I'M BOOSTING THE LINE!
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby MarbitChow » Wed Jul 11, 2012 6:08 am

The Colonel wrote:Will the uncroaked croak after we croak the dagron?

Nope. They are normal uncroaked once they're reconstituted. The structures will cease functioning, so no more will be created, but all the ones that get spawned prior to that point will still need to be taken care of. (Your exceptional analysis of the structures, coupled with your intimate knowledge of croakamancy, allow you to draw this conclusion with certainty.)

Swodaems wrote:Don't I still get Leadership's +1 XP bonus to my croaks?

No, you only get leadership XP from other unit's kills: "Leaders gain 1 XP for every kill made by any unit using their leadership bonus (besides themselves) in their stack."

Swodaems wrote:Our best option for closing it is to try to argue MarbitChow into reconjuring L15 and L16 into D9 and D6. (All the arguments I can think of at the moment boil down to, "Surely we're more competent than to leave such a weakness right next to an enemy respawn point."

Uncroaked still ultimately answer to Bill. Blue Man Group's position was done primarily to protect him first and foremost, especially since he was reduced to 3 hits this round. L16 at D6 would leave a gap that 2 units could reach Bill through this round, with a good chance that both Tod and Rolf would not be able to get to the gap in time. While it might be obvious to you upon reflection that Will could pop L02 and open a hole for Rolf to charge in to plug the gap, that sort of tactical foresight is beyond the ability of the uncroaked. (Based on The Colonel's previous responses to Bill being in danger, I'd argue that Bill's instinctive reactions also support the uncroaked's current position.)

A gap needed to exist, and the uncroaked (and, let's be honest, probably Bill as well) preferred that the gap be near William rather than Bill.

Werebiscuit wrote:Marbit can either Triage or T.Coil pass their potion to Bill and him drink it in the one action ? Or is that 2 seperate actions ?
I believe you said it was possible to feed a player a heal potion does this also stand for a juice potion ? /OOC

The casters need to be adjacent to pass a potion. Once they are adjacent, passing a potion is a free action. However, drinking a potion is an action, so Bill can't drink and cast in the same round.
Pouring a healing potion into an unit's mouth actually uses up the action for both the pouring unit and the target. The target is normally incapacitated when you do this, so they would not have been able to use their action for anything other than swallowing the potion that round. Think of it as a special case where an incapacitated CAN take the action "swallow potion". So, short answer is that no one else can spend their action to grant Juice to Bill and have Bill be able to take an action in this same round.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby The Colonel » Wed Jul 11, 2012 6:38 am

Sorry for being so selfish dudes.

Tod, target the red dancer closest to you.

Rolf, Drop BW3.

Will, attack another of the red dancers. that should be enough to even the odds, I hope

T.Coil, your choice, hit the Dagron or hit another red dancer.

Everyone else, Dance to the beat and beat the Dagron.

That good enough? Will the dagron be croaked by next turn?

Somebody pass me a potion so I can boost the line next turn.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby ETheBoyce » Wed Jul 11, 2012 12:29 pm

If Trogdor is still unalive I'll Hoboken him, otherwise Hoboken/Hiya a Champion or some other target.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby BLANDCorporatio » Wed Jul 11, 2012 3:51 pm

The red dancers aren't even arrow-resistant. I think I should make minced meat of one.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby Werebiscuit » Wed Jul 11, 2012 4:42 pm

ETheBoyce wrote:If Trogdor is still unalive I'll Hoboken him, otherwise Hoboken/Hiya a Champion or some other target.


OOC You realize that you can walk two steps towards Bill, pass him the potion (free action) and still do what you plan above ? Unless of course you think you'll need the juice potion yourself...in which case I'll say exactly the same to Watermonkey/Triage. If it's a case of clustering you're worried about I'll have Rolf come that way to run interference on any insurgent dancers/champions. We'll still have next round after that to find a burninate resistant formation but hopefully by then Trogdor will have worries of his own. /OOC
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby WaterMonkey314 » Thu Jul 12, 2012 1:45 am

I'll pass the potion if there's no objections.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby MarbitChow » Thu Jul 12, 2012 9:35 am

Just a quick heads-up: due to workload issues, I won't be able to run the next turn before Monday at the earliest, so take your time to discuss your next moves if needed. This will probably be the last turn for this encounter, since I should be able to extrapolate the 7th (and, if necessary, 8th) turn moves based on the results of the 6th.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby Werebiscuit » Thu Jul 12, 2012 10:08 am

MarbitChow wrote: since I should be able to extrapolate the 7th (and, if necessary, 8th) turn moves based on the results of the 6th.

OOC Wait ! Next Turn's the 6th ?

WaterMonkey... you might want to forget that potion exchange as it will leave you nicely clustered next to Bill for a burninate which I believe trogdor can do on action 20 of round 7 (i.e. before Triage and Bill can move apart) presenting him with an irresistable target /OOC
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby The Colonel » Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:12 am

But I can groove the Dagron now, I have the scroll and drink the potion the next turn.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby The Colonel » Sun Jul 15, 2012 10:56 am

Sorry for the doublepost but,

This is the plan I'm guessing we're following?

Tod, target the red dancer closest to you.

Rolf, Drop BW3.

Will, attack another of the red dancers. that should be enough to even the odds, I hope

T.Coil, your choice, hit the Dagron or hit another red dancer.

Everyone else, Dance to the beat and beat the Dagron.

Casters with nothing to do, Fire on the enemy uncroaked.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby Exate » Sun Jul 15, 2012 1:48 pm

That sounds about right to me. I suspect that the Bone Dagron will be absorbing all subsequent slain uncroaked for the health boosts, given how close it is to dusting.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby Swodaems » Sun Jul 15, 2012 3:56 pm

Sorry for being out of the loop for a few days. (I got sick. Vomit everywhere.)

As for the question of how much damage we do to Trogdor next round, I'm afraid to say it is going to be significantly less than than the 91 damage we did this round. (We rolled good there:6*~9+~8+~15= ~78) That's because I cannot justify not giving a bonus to the uncroaked defending the casters at the moment, there by depriving some of the attackers of some damage. That means, at best, we'll only have T. Coil's ~15 +Yuri's ~8+(4*~10) +(2*~3) for a total of ~69 damage, (or more likely ~56 if Trogodor manages to dust another member of Green man group before they can attack.) Depending on how he decides to use his unit-eating, self-heal option, we could be seeing a lot more of him for no small number of rounds. (2 22 hit uncroaked and 4 14 hit uncroaked were destroyed last round, so he can heal up to 100 hits at the start of next round if he chooses not to remake them.)

The Colonel, I'm sorry to be attacking your plan, but I have to point out a few problems that I see with it. (I'm a believer in the idea that the best way to come up with a plan for some thing is to have everybody come up with their own seperate ideas and then grind them against each other until the ideas form a coherent whole.)

The biggest problem is that it ignores that it is possible that we're going to see a hoard of units (2 bone champions and 4 lesser dancers again,) popping in front of H portal if Trogdor decides not to eat them. Units popping in G10&9, H10&9 and I10&9 will find themselves capable of moving to strike Will's, Triage's, and maybe your current positions, possibly incapacitating or croaking their targets. (The 2 Bone champions have combat 8, so they move before both you and Triage. Will can move out of range before they can act, but if neither me nor Rolf can reach a blocking position in time, then the two of us will need to make sure to eliminate at least 1 of the bone champions before they can move. A double team of bone champions attacking Triage will likely remove him from the fight via incapacitation or croaking.)

The second problem is that it is inefficient. Since I have an ability that allows me to strike two targets per round, I should use it if I am free to attack next round. ('Free to attack next round' is read as 'Nothing of note pops at portal H'.) Hitting L05 & L06 or BW3 & L06 would be a better choice. (I will of course be using Lunge at Portal H targets if the opportunity arises.)

As for the idea of you drinking another potion, I'm sorry, but I don't really see the value in doing that right now. You might be able to raise a couple more skeles to aid in the fight, but we're not going to be able to get as much use out of them now as we would have earlier. Sure, having another skele right now to block the hole would be a great help, but by the time you can actually raise it, (at combat 6 in round 7 or 8,) the need will have passed. If he gets it, Trogdor's round 7 burnination will likely be his last, and we'll be able to safely use a tighter formation to hold things away from Will and the casters in later rounds. (And there will be significatly fewer things to hold off after next round. Trogdor will incapable of summoning up the numbers he has been, either due to him being dust or having to eat his own units to survive.)

The Colonel wrote:But I can groove the Dagron now, I have the scroll and drink the potion the next turn.

Using the Groove scroll is a good idea, but you might want to consider a change in target(s) if certain things happen. This round, you would be able to move faster than any lesser dancers spawning at portal H, so if I can't block them before they can act, you might be able to potentially stop 3 threats from taking advantage of the hole in our defenses for the turn.

My Plan for the next round: (Feel free to toss it in the grinder as you see fit.)
First off, the big conditonal for this plan is that it changes based on what spawns from various portals:
1: If we get nothing, (unlikely,) we go with a 'wipe them all out and smack the dagron down' plan. Will moves first for us and dusts L04. Rolf now has a path to H3, where he can hit BW3 hard. I go to L5, where I lunge L05 and L06. Cupid, Bill and Triage take down L02 with fire attacks. Any survivors can be mopped up by the defense line if they reach it or left for later turns. (The defense line does shift up one space after this.) T. Coil, Yuri and the attack dancers continue to pound away on Trogdor.
2:If we get a hoard at Portal H: This part has seperate sub-conditionals based on the formation we see. (This is where the decision to give the defense line an 8/8 bonus pays off.)
2A:If I9 (As I understand the portals, popping things in I9 requires that other units pop in G10, H10 and I10. Is J9 is out of range, assuming units in G10, H10, and I10? I'll modify these plans as needed if popping in J9 is possible.) is empty, it is a formation that I can get around to the other side of by having Will blast L04 out of my way. Everything but my action follows the 'Wipe them all out plan'. If I9 is not empty, things get more complicated. Bill might have a good choice of targets for his groove scroll here.
2B:If either of the units in I10 and I9 is a bone champion, then Will should drop L04 to allow both Rolf and I access to it. The two of us working together should drop it and ensure that only 1 bone champ capable of reaching the back lines remains before the casters can act. Will should have moved close to T. Coil before firing and at combat 6 Triage heals himself and moves towards the corner as well. (Yes, I am advocating clustering Will and the casters right before a burninate, but I think it sadly is the best option for those circumstances.) When the lessers moves, L15 goes to B7, but L13 and L16 stay where they are. Bill might have a good choice of targets for his groove scroll here.
2C:If I10 & I9 both contain lessers, but G9 is empty: After Will drops L04, I attack I9 to try and give Rolf a path to F9. Will should still move next to T. Coil before firing as a safety measure. (BTW, the reason that I've written the conditionals in such a way that attacking a bone champion in I10 is our first option even if a lesser appears in I9 is that both Rolf and I have a real chance to fail one-hit dusting a lesser with a +3 dance-fighting bonus, preventing us from getting to the hole. Failure on our parts to either close that hole or destroy one of the bone champions before Combat =8 means that we can expect Triage to take 2 attacks from bone champions.) Bill might have a good choice of targets for his groove scroll here.
2D: If I10 & I9 both contain lessers, but G9 contains anything at all: After Will drops L04, Rolf attacks I9 to try and give me a path to F9. Will should still move next to T. Coil before firing as a safety measure. Bill might have a good choice of targets for his groove scroll here.
3: A horde (at least 3 uncroaked) comes from M portal: This is is no doubt part of some heinous plan. Will blasts L04 to give me better access to the 2 right portals. Provided nothing at H demands I block the hole, Rolf and I do the attack and contain thing with me attacking first. If I am needed at H, Rolf has to do it alone. (I apologize in advance if their plan was 'Give Rolf a pounding".) After weathering the attacks of BW3 and L06, our 3 defense zombies try to move up a square before counter attacking, (while making sure to have at least one counter attack on Bw3.) Bill might have a good choice of targets for his groove scroll here, and can possibly negate our need to defend a portal if only lessers come from it.
4: A horde (at least 3 uncroaked) comes from R portal: This is is no doubt part of some heinous plan. Will blasts L04 to give me better access to the 2 right portals. Provided nothing at H demands I block the hole, Rolf, Yuri and I do the attack and contain thing with me attacking first. If I am needed at H, Rolf have to do it together. After weathering the attacks of BW3 and L06, our 3 defense zombies try to move up a square before counter attacking, (while making sure to have at least one counter attack on Bw3.) Bill might have a good choice of targets for his groove scroll here, and can possibly negate our need to defend a portal if only lessers come from it.

In summary, I think that Will blasting L04 should be our first move in all cases.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby MarbitChow » Sun Jul 15, 2012 4:20 pm

I hope you're feeling better. Getting sick sucks.
Swodaems wrote:As I understand the portals, popping things in I9 requires that other units pop in G10, H10 and I10. Is J9 is out of range, assuming units in G10, H10, and I10?

That's correct - units will pop closest to the structure as possible. They'll only pop farther away if the closest squares are already occupied by friend or foe.

Also, note that I've posted a (near-final) draft of the next revision of the rules at the end of the Rules thread. Please let me know if you see any glaring flaws or would like additional clarification; these rules will be going into effect after the current scenario is complete.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby HerbieRai » Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:33 am

Hey guys, what gap do you want me to fill? I can land and probably take a few hits from the lesser uncroaked.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby BLANDCorporatio » Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:38 am

Will shall try to redust whatever undead's most threatening to the back line. Arrows aren't much good against Trogdor, but they should lay to rest (again) an uncroaked Marbit.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby Swodaems » Mon Jul 16, 2012 11:44 am

HerbieRai wrote:Hey guys, what gap do you want me to fill? I can land and probably take a few hits from the lesser uncroaked.

You have def 6, 16 hits and a ward. The enemies that attack you are likely to have Com 8. That means you'll be taking 2+2d6 (~9) damage per attack. You can likely stand up to 2 of those without healing, but a 3rd will lay you out flat. I can see a benefit to placing you in the hole for a short time, but care is going to be needed.

I also have some questions I would like answered before using you like that:
Both Cupid and the bone champions move at combat =8. Could he block their movement by landing or would he only be able to block the later moving lessers?
If he chooses to take off again in the round after next, could a bone champion standing directly adjacent to him still get an attack in before he did so? What about one that has to travel before attacking him?

BLANDCorporatio wrote:Will shall try to redust whatever undead's most threatening to the back line. Arrows aren't much good against Trogdor, but they should lay to rest (again) an uncroaked Marbit.

None of the undead currently shown on the field should be able to actually reach the back line this round. (I'm putting the defensive line in the +8/+8 stack, so it should hold.) What we need to be worried about is units that spawn from the H portal. Those will be able to reach you and Triage thru the hole in our defense. You attacking any spawners directly is an option, but if you take out L04, you'll be able to free up Rolf (and myself depending on enemy respawn positions) to try and solve any problem beyond your power to deal with.

(Note: assuming Trogdor summons the full 4 additional dancers, the enemy lessers will have 9 def. You'll have a 1/36 failure chance to dust one if you use mighty blowX2, but you'll drop the com/def of the remaining dancers by 1 if you succeed. (Given how much a drop of 1 helps my or Rolf's chances to dust lessers with our attacks, I want your action to be the first thing the party does.) You'll also unfortunately drop your own def by 4 during a round where that might matter. (Assuming com 8 attackers, you take 7+2d6 per attack.) Under certain circumstances, you may want to move your character down into the corner for protection before firing. (Yes, despite the fact this clusters you.)
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby MarbitChow » Mon Jul 16, 2012 12:07 pm

Swodaems wrote:Both Cupid and the bone champions move at combat =8. Could he block their movement by landing or would he only be able to block the later moving lessers?
If he chooses to take off again in the round after next, could a bone champion standing directly adjacent to him still get an attack in before he did so? What about one that has to travel before attacking him?

If both moves are simultaneous, each unit moves one square at a time along their intended path until a collision occurs. (Cupid would actually get 3 squares move for ever 2 a grounded unit moves, landing counts as 1 square as well, and on the ground he's back to moving at the same speed.) If both try to occupy the same square at the same time, both roll 2d6, higher roll gets the square and other unit is pushed away from the winner by 1 square. So, short answer is that Cupid can block a champion.

A bone champion standing directly in front of him could attack him as he launches up (recall that flying up costs 2 squares), as could a champion 1 square away, but any champion further away would not reach him in time.
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby Swodaems » Mon Jul 16, 2012 2:18 pm

MarbitChow wrote:
Swodaems wrote:Both Cupid and the bone champions move at combat =8. Could he block their movement by landing or would he only be able to block the later moving lessers?
If he chooses to take off again in the round after next, could a bone champion standing directly adjacent to him still get an attack in before he did so? What about one that has to travel before attacking him?

If both moves are simultaneous, each unit moves one square at a time along their intended path until a collision occurs. (Cupid would actually get 3 squares move for ever 2 a grounded unit moves, landing counts as 1 square as well, and on the ground he's back to moving at the same speed.) If both try to occupy the same square at the same time, both roll 2d6, higher roll gets the square and other unit is pushed away from the winner by 1 square. So, short answer is that Cupid can block a champion.

A bone champion standing directly in front of him could attack him as he launches up (recall that flying up costs 2 squares), as could a champion 1 square away, but any champion further away would not reach him in time.


Okay, if the farthest forward a Bone champion can spawn is in either G10 or G9, I think this means that Cupid could reach the ground in D10 before the theorectical champion without having to roll as that is 2 squares and a drop away (3 flier move) from Cupid's position in the air above F10. The champion would only get 2 move to Cupid's 3 and could only reach E by that time. However, if he were to try to land in E10 or F10, I think he would have to roll against a champion trying to enter the same square starting from G10. (Am I right?)

If the enemy swarms portal H and Cupid has to land in D10 to block them from the casters, we can expect him to take two attacks this round from units in E10 and E9. (Assuming Com 8 attackers, he has a 5.40% chance of being knocked into the 0 to -4 range.) This damage will need to be healed before the next round, either by Triage alone if the damage is light enough or by using both a scroll from Bill and ward from Triage. With Burninate coming and the potential for 1 or 2 attacks before Cupid can take off, he will need the health. (Leadership this round goes to the 8/8 group, but if Cupid lands, he replaces one of the dagron attackers in the 7th round. He'll only get 4/4 from it, but he'll need it.)

In my mind, using Cupid to fill the hole is a risky desperation play. I would prefer either myself or Rolf be used for the task, but Cupid may have to fill the hole if the actions of Will, Rolf, and I fail to do so before Combat = 8 and other options fail. If we do it, we are practically sacrificing Cupid by allowing him to take 2 attacks this round with the potential for more in the next. Option 2B in my above plan has me and Rolf eliminating one new Bone champion and letting the other one get an attack in on Triage, followed by solidifying our defenses. Letting our healer take a single hit, then grouping up right before a burninate seems like a better option than letting Cupid take 2 hits. The damage will of course be painful, but everyone should live provided Triage reWards himself during round 6. (Note: Cupid's landing can be worked into plan 2B. If L15 is blocked from reaching B7, Cupid can land where he protects the casters from melee in round 7, but only takes one attack (or possibly no attacks) from a lesser uncroaked. We should keep him out of the same 3X3 as the wounded Triage, but there is less risk of anybody croaking.)

Aside from the 2B modification I mentioned, the only other reason I would have for taking Cupid up on his landing offer would be to deliberately sacrifice him in place of Triage. If we fail to croak the bone champion for plan 2B or are unable to croak the lesser in plans 2C and 2D, then options 2E: 'the pragmatic choice to sacrifice our flier for our healomancer by landing him in D10' and 2F: 'Let the healomancer fall' become our only remaining contingincies. (Note: there is no 2G 'Sac the archer instead', because Will should have already moved to A3 and fired before the plans were confirmed to have failed. (At least, he should have for option 2B. For 2C and 2D, he could technically move to a sacrificial position prefiring.))
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Re: Darkness Rising

Postby MarbitChow » Mon Jul 16, 2012 3:23 pm

Swodaems wrote:Okay, if the farthest forward a Bone champion can spawn is in either G10 or G9, I think this means that Cupid could reach the ground in D10 before the theorectical champion without having to roll as that is 2 squares and a drop away (3 flier move) from Cupid's position in the air above F10. The champion would only get 2 move to Cupid's 3 and could only reach E by that time. However, if he were to try to land in E10 or F10, I think he would have to roll against a champion trying to enter the same square starting from G10. (Am I right?)
That is correct.
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