Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby YesNinja » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:06 am

Wait, wait, wait. It's only been 100 turns since the fall of Haffaton? How many turns has it been since TBFGK?
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby Tonot » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:07 am

"I don't think she went back where I'm from".

So Judy wasn't "our" Dorothy then, and Charlie isn't "our" Oz. So why does it matter to Charlie to keep the story secret from Parson, if it isn't actually our story?.

Is he just trying to keep only the ideas, the themes of "our" Wizard of Oz off Parsons mind, trying to avoid Parson thinking about Wizard of Oz ploys?.
Last edited by Tonot on Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby Sky Schemer » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:13 am

YesNinja wrote:Wait, wait, wait. It's only been 100 turns since the fall of Haffaton? How many turns has it been since TBFGK?


"Hundred-turns" is probably their way of referencing "a long time", since they don't have months or years. So he's not saying a literal "hundred turns", but rather several "hundred-turn" periods.
Last edited by Sky Schemer on Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby Tonot » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:16 am

ManaCaster wrote: The only reference Parson himself has is his name (A protagonist), which isn't the most visible of things.


I don't actually get the reference to his name, I have to admit.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby CorrTerek » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:17 am

ManaCaster wrote:Well, Parson comes from a close variation of our world, and his quest has been a whole smorgasboard of references to no one thing, while Judy Gale's quest matches the story of the Wizard of Oz just a little too closely. The only reference Parson himself has is his name (A protagonist), which isn't the most visible of things. With Judy Gale, the references are pretty blatant, to the point that Parson knows who Dorothy Gale and Judy Garland are. It would be pretty coincidental if someone from a world with that story and film not only happened to have the correct name, but was also a suitable target for the Summon Perfect Warlord spell. And as noted earlier, we are assuming that Parson comes from a close variation of our world, not some variation of our world with all sorts of parodies.


That's all true, but did we ever get an idea of what time period Judy came from? Was it before or after the Oz books were written?

I seem to recall someone mentioning that Judy found the story she was living through familiar -- which would shoot down my idea that the Wizard of Oz story is based off Judy's story but would imply that Judy was also from a world with Oz stories, which would then imply that Parson's assumption was faulty. Does anyone else remember anything like that?
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby ManaCaster » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:30 am

Tonot wrote:
ManaCaster wrote: The only reference Parson himself has is his name (A protagonist), which isn't the most visible of things.


I don't actually get the reference to his name, I have to admit.

"Parson A. Gotti" is an anagram for "A Protagonist", and by extension one of Erfworld's jokes (though a less visible one).
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby Tonot » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:31 am

Oh, thanks, I guess someone did talk about that and it just went over my head. Is there a thread with collected jokes people have uncovered?.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby LordBiscuit » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:35 am

David's art is improving. I really like the way he did Jack in this update.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby ManaCaster » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:37 am

Tonot wrote:Oh, thanks, I guess someone did talk about that and it just went over my head. Is there a thread with collected jokes people have uncovered?.

I dunno, but the Wiki pages have a real world references section, and the Parson page itself mentions this in the trivia section.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby Lipkin » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:39 am

Tonot wrote:"I don't think she when back where I'm from".

So Judy wasn't "our" Dorothy then, and Charlie isn't "our" Oz. So why does it matter to Charlie to keep the story secret from Parson, if it isn't actually our story?.

Is he just trying to keep only the ideas, the themes of "our" Wizard of Oz off Parsons mind, trying to avoid Parson thinking about Wizard of Oz ploys?.

So, in situations like this, we are usually lead to believe that the story of Oz that we know was actually inspired by the tale of Judy in Erf. I'm pretty sure that's not the case here.

It's very unlikely that the only two worlds that exist are Erf and Stupid World. I think Oz is real, and it shares parallels with Erf just like Stupid World does.

Oh. Oh boop.

The Summon Perfect Warlord spell. Wanda said it could summon someone from anywhere in existence. If all fiction is within reach, because in this narrative all fiction is true, than any fictional character could be summoned to Erf given the right spell, and the right price. Imagine what Parson could do with that knowledge.

Who is a character that is both crazy powerful, and (because there are still limits to what Rob has access to) in the public domain?

Imagine Parson raising the funds to summon Thor or Hercules.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby ManaCaster » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:57 am

Lipkin wrote:
Tonot wrote:"I don't think she when back where I'm from".

So Judy wasn't "our" Dorothy then, and Charlie isn't "our" Oz. So why does it matter to Charlie to keep the story secret from Parson, if it isn't actually our story?.

Is he just trying to keep only the ideas, the themes of "our" Wizard of Oz off Parsons mind, trying to avoid Parson thinking about Wizard of Oz ploys?.

So, in situations like this, we are usually lead to believe that the story of Oz that we know was actually inspired by the tale of Judy in Erf. I'm pretty sure that's not the case here.

It's very unlikely that the only two worlds that exist are Erf and Stupid World. I think Oz is real, and it shares parallels with Erf just like Stupid World does.

Oh. Oh boop.

The Summon Perfect Warlord spell. Wanda said it could summon someone from anywhere in existence. If all fiction is within reach, because in this narrative all fiction is true, than any fictional character could be summoned to Erf given the right spell, and the right price. Imagine what Parson could do with that knowledge.

Who is a character that is both crazy powerful, and (because there are still limits to what Rob has access to) in the public domain?

Imagine Parson raising the funds to summon Thor or Hercules.

The upkeep for those figures might be a little out of Gobwin Knob's price range. Assuming Erfworld's magic is even enough to control them.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby jkosta » Sat Aug 31, 2013 3:34 am

No one has brought this up yet?

Epilogue 07 wrote:"When you shared that piece of your mythology with me, it was all I could do not to break my contract with Charlescomm in astonishment," he said, nodding and grinning. "I could feel the magical weight of the spell clamping down on me."


Also, it's Jack in spades.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby Tonot » Sat Aug 31, 2013 3:45 am

Lipkin wrote:Oh. Oh boop.

The Summon Perfect Warlord spell. Wanda said it could summon someone from anywhere in existence. If all fiction is within reach, because in this narrative all fiction is true, than any fictional character could be summoned to Erf given the right spell, and the right price. Imagine what Parson could do with that knowledge.

Who is a character that is both crazy powerful, and (because there are still limits to what Rob has access to) in the public domain?

Imagine Parson raising the funds to summon Thor or Hercules.


Lol. Parson summons Gary Gygax, Erf-world expresses his being as a Titan.

Would summoning Jason Blood get you his "special attack" too, when he spoke his personal spell-poem?.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby Lipkin » Sat Aug 31, 2013 3:58 am

Tonot wrote:
Lipkin wrote:Oh. Oh boop.

The Summon Perfect Warlord spell. Wanda said it could summon someone from anywhere in existence. If all fiction is within reach, because in this narrative all fiction is true, than any fictional character could be summoned to Erf given the right spell, and the right price. Imagine what Parson could do with that knowledge.

Who is a character that is both crazy powerful, and (because there are still limits to what Rob has access to) in the public domain?

Imagine Parson raising the funds to summon Thor or Hercules.


Lol. Parson summons Gary Gygax, Erf-world expresses his being as a Titan.

Would summoning Jason Blood get you his "special attack" too, when he spoke his personal spell-poem?.

"Gone, gone, the form of man?"

Sounds like rhyme-o-mancy triggered changemancy to me!

The real question is, would the demon be bound by the loyalty spells?
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby ManaCaster » Sat Aug 31, 2013 4:16 am

So, Blair and Bell were defeated, but I wonder, do they have a couple of other sisters? In the Oz books, there was a wicked witch of the North and South too. Not much info about the wicked witch of the south, but there's plenty for the north. The witch of the north was named Mombi, who was defeated, but never killed, and merely faded into insignificance after being forced to restore the rightful ruler of Oz. I'm guessing from that bit of weirdness that any Erfworld equivalent to Mombi would be a Changemancer living in the Magic Kingdom?
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby programancer » Sat Aug 31, 2013 4:40 am

Voice acting is good, I like it.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby mortissimus » Sat Aug 31, 2013 4:52 am

I'd like to note that with Jacks hundred-turns (which I interpret as several hundreds of turns) it is still just a couple of years ago.

Sixty wrote:Does seem odd that Parson thinks she couldn't have gone back to Earth. Does he assume everyone would have heard of her story then? I mean, most people would just write her off as crazy if she claimed to have returned from another world and had magic shoes (that probably don't do that much on Earth, at least having infinite move wouldn't mean much here unless it also made you not tired from waking 24/7.


Well, even if walking 24/7 would be strange, In don't think she would be famous. I think she would be a hobo.

I think Parson noting that she is not form his world is just Robs way of putting to rest a topic of much confusion. The Arkensaw bit streghtens that, since Arkensaw speculation once ran rampart cross the forum (Sizmore attunes to it in most speculation).

Edit: should have refreshed my memory first, it is the Arkenshovel Sizemore attunes to.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby Lilwik » Sat Aug 31, 2013 5:22 am

mortissimus wrote:I think Parson noting that she is not form his world is just Robs way of putting to rest a topic of much confusion.
What confusion are you talking about? There's a possibility that Judy is from Stupidworld and a possibility that she's from some other Kansas, but as far as I'm aware those possibilities weren't confusing in any way. At least they were nowhere near as confusing as the rules about barbarians. All that Parson says is that he doesn't think that Judy is from his world, and he seems uncertain about that because Kansas is a place in Stupidworld, so this doesn't seem to put anything to rest.

Perhaps only reason that Parson doubts Judy is from Stupidworld is because it would be too much of a coincidence for a Stupidworlder to come to Erfworld and just happen to recreate the Wizard of Oz, so obviously it would have to work the other way around: Judy's adventure in Erfworld must have inspired the book. It's natural to think that the book could have had an inspiration like that, but he says "How could I grow up with the story, then?" Because the events that inspired it happened only several years ago, and the book was written long before Parson was born. He might be assuming that none of the Erfworlders are much older than they look, since Jack would need to be over a hundred years old to have been part of the inspiration for the Wizard of Oz.

On the other hand, whether she is from Stupidworld or not, Erfworld has still somehow recreated the Wizard of Oz decades after it was written as a work of fiction, and that coincidence is no more or less strange wherever Judy came from or disappeared to. Surely the natural explanation would be that Judy came from Stupidworld over a hundred years before Parson's time, and returned in time to inspire the novel, meaning that Erfworld magic is capable of time travel within Stupidworld. Even so, Parson can't be thinking that explanation because then it wouldn't be "weird" for Judy to be from Kansas.

Surely Rob had no intention of putting to rest a topic of much confusion because it seems that he has actually created a topic of much confusion where none had previously existed.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby BakaGrappler » Sat Aug 31, 2013 5:53 am

I like the art style for Jack in this update. The upturned hand with the uneven fingers gives a more realistic touch to the minimalism of the portrait, having Jack's entire posture looking more natural than figures in several of the previous epilogues. I think David is getting the hang of the tiny body types for Erfworld now, and I really like his take on Jack's features. He's got an everyday non-athletic handsomeness (that loses out to guys like Ansom) coupled with a heavy eye-lidded intuitive cunning. I feel like David has captured Jack's essence in his take of him.

Now give me more Jack! It's been too long since he's looked at the world in a sane light, and we need to know if he's still a Caster or has had it stripped from him as a Decrypted! None of the Decrypted have tried to cast spells yet! Spare me the belly gouging wait!

For the story. Yeah. Charlie knows exactly what Parson is. Which is why he's so desperate.

EDIT:
Jack in Black. Black Jack. Jack Black. Jack: Back in Black.
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Re: Book 2 – Epilogue 07 – Jack in Black

Postby Zippy the Squirrel » Sat Aug 31, 2013 7:01 am

Aw, look at that! That is some damn fine art! Love it, can't wait to see it fully unleashed upon the regular Book panels.
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