Nihila wrote:Siralus, about the defense thing I mentioned in WaterMonkey's thread, actually, defense would deal only half damage.
If we have two units with 4 attack and 2 defense fight, the attacker will deal, on average, 4-2=2 damage, but the defender will deal, on average, 2-1=1 damage. That's huge if multiplied by, say, 8 or 9.
Ok, scratch everything, because I've noticed my wits are comparable in dimness to a room with no light bulbs or windows. At midnight. Underground.
I just realised I've tried to account for the same thing twice in my rules, once near the very top, and once near the very bottom, and one of these rules needs to go or flip turned upside down. So, yes, I think I will scratch halving of retaliatory damage.
The other thing I did was make stack bonuses only apply for what you're doing, so attackers only gain attack, and defenders only gain defense, and that seems to pan out well.
Although I'll tell you now, 4/2 is pretty tame in this system. I'll just run an example ala flow of consciousness for myself and for everyone else here on how this runs by doing a couple of combat examples. (After removing the halving of retaliatory damage)
One, a single unit of stats 6/5 Attacks a single unit with 3/7. No modifiers whatsoever. So that attacker does 6+ d6 - the defender's defense (7). He needs to beat the defender's roll slightly to actually do damage, (i.e. by 2 or more). But the defender in turn, needs to beat the attacker's roll to deal retaliatory damage, by 3 or more. So, if the attacking unit expends lots of move just flailing madly against this defensive unit, it could probably break it down after a couple of lucky combats.
Now, lets try a very detailed example.
A stack of 8 knights from the nation of Darkovan riding Jaguarille (a few posts above now), led by a level 3 warlord, is attacking a heavily entrenched 9 unit stack of their own nation's (Yay, civil war!) pikemen, who are led by a masterful, level 6 warlord. Now, 8 special, mounted units in a stack, + the level 3 warlord, cost 705 gold per turn to maintain. This is a pricey, full on, super special stack on doom drugs which is here to deliver pain to your face. It'd take all of a level 4 city's income to keep this stack afloat.
The defender, comparatively, costs 405 gold per turn to upkeep, a sizeable chunk being spent on that super awesome warlord. Lets do some mathamancy now, shall we?
The attacker has 8*7 attack for the knights, and they gain +5 from their mounts, starting them at 12. They're rider units attacking with polearms, giving them +2. They've got +4 stack bonus, they've got +3 leadership bonus. This all adds up to a total 21, per unit. Giving them a grand sum of 8*21 = 168, plus the warlord's own 6+ stack bonus for another 10. So the attackers have 168. I'm rolling a real dice now... 3. So, 171.
The defenders, have 6 defense. They are fully stacked, for +4. They have the formations special, which will give them + 1. They have a massive +6 leadership bonus, and a further +1 from using polearms in an appropriately sized stack. That's 18 each, for 9 units. That's 9*18 = 162. This is actually quite close, isn't it? The warlord is here, offering up 11 more defense after stack bonus. That's 173. I'll roll my d6 178. The super drugged up doom stack has in fact, been trumped by superior positioning and leadership, it would seem. They've fallen just a sliver short of actually dealing damage to the ranked up pikemen pushing their cat mounts off the cliffs, cackling with delight as they watch the shining knights tumble all the way back down to the bottom of the cliff.
We may as well look at retaliatory damage. The attacker has 4 defense, +2 from mount, +3 from leadership. Oh my. Well, we're at 9 defense here, multiplied by 8 equates to 72. Plus the warlord's own 8, for 80, and the d6 says? 3. 83 then. Lets see what the defending unit is throwing back as damage. Well, they've got 3 basic, with + 1 from their formations bonus, and + 1 from their polearms type. Then they've got their +6 leadership bonus. Well. Oh dear. That's a total of 11 attack per unit. So that's 11*9 = 99. Plus the warlord's own extra 8, adding up to 107. Let's just roll my trusty d6 here... a 1,
Well, that's 108 then. This gives us an excess of 14 over the enemy's defense. We're doing 14 hits back then! Ah, but, some GM was clever enough to put the armoured special on these knights. Randomly allocating these 14 hits between 17 units has let us do a hit to the warlord, and one hit to each of 7 mount units, while the knights have happily deflected the blows of their enemies. So, despite the scale of combat, defensive positions and weapons have made light of the situation, and the knights are probably wary of charging up into the mountain ledges again.
This is more my concern. I was, quietly tempted to have a percentile reduction of final defense values so that every fight could be messier, but I'm not sure how I actually feel about that. Opinions?