Book 2 – Text Updates 042

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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby atalex » Wed Mar 02, 2011 8:03 pm

Also, rereading some of the Pinochet-related comments, I have to ask: How can Rob's use of the name be considered insulting to anyone? All he did was use the name, and there's not enough context to even attach a political slant to that use. And even if you choose to view the use of the name as somehow directly comparing Slately to Pinochet, how is that insulting to either? Are we talking about a tyrannical bastard who finally got what he deserved or an elderly ruler chased into exile in the twilight of his life? Either interpretation is potentially valid for Slately, Pinochet or both.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby Chit Rule Railroad » Wed Mar 02, 2011 10:27 pm

atalex wrote:My suspicion, however, is that "Pinochet" was used to invoke the idea that most of us who are NOT students of Chilean history have of the real-life Pinochet, i.e. an elderly and somewhat ruthless leader who was forced from his throne and sent into exile at the end of his life. YMMV. I really can't think of a better word for Slately to have used that wouldn't have been even more obscure than Pinochet.


That makes it sound like a foreshadowing of Don's fate. Don, who instituted an oddly economics-oriented approach to managing his kingdom, and tried to make Caesar disappear.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby kreszantas » Wed Mar 02, 2011 10:59 pm

atalex wrote:Also, rereading some of the Pinochet-related comments, I have to ask: How can Rob's use of the name be considered insulting to anyone? All he did was use the name, and there's not enough context to even attach a political slant to that use. And even if you choose to view the use of the name as somehow directly comparing Slately to Pinochet, how is that insulting to either? Are we talking about a tyrannical bastard who finally got what he deserved or an elderly ruler chased into exile in the twilight of his life? Either interpretation is potentially valid for Slately, Pinochet or both.


Ok, well that to you is the in the eye of the beholder again. Do you even know who and how this all got started? Well a group called the Chicago Boys decided to do a little "field economic experiment" those boys had to practically dismantle the old economy to restore it to a "USA" friendly economy meaning removing the Socialist aspects from it. This experiment is the basis of what Obama is now doing only in reverse to the USA... makes you wonder now does it. The Chileain example was actually used as a South American model that it can succeed but it had a higher cost than was expected. I am not excusing or an apologist for Pinochet merely stating at it related to the economy and that alone and it should stick to just that.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby RichMan » Wed Mar 02, 2011 11:51 pm

Signamancy is real in Erfworld. If you are a big tough fighter, you are a big tough fighter. Trammeris did not have the signamancy of a big tough fighter. Zamussels had the big tough barbarian fighter signamancy until she became Queen, then she softened. Tram would have had the signamancy of a fop/dandy/courtier hence the diplomatic assignment. I don't think we have seen any bias on Erf world for gender specific traits, just role specific stuff as covered by signamancy.

It is the bias of Stanley and Slately that they wanted the big tough fighter signamancy for their warlords. You could say they got lost in the signs. If command is the real power of a warlord then you want smarts for your warlords, the really fighter type qualities like hit points and attack power only come into it if the warlord is actually engaging other units.

Having a warlord actually engage other units is a risk because you might lose the valuable warlord. It is also useful because you want the warlords bonus for their stack and hex and as Parson has noted to really win you stack bonuses (aka Parson + Wanda + dance fighting uncroaked ). So there is value to stats in the warlord if you are going to put them into combat stacks.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby GaryThunder » Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:12 am

Top-level warlords don't seem to lose against any opponent but other top-level warlords, commanded dwagons, or similar huge threats. I'd say they're not at that much risk, usually. Caesar took the Arkenhammer to the face and wasn't even incapacitated. (Maybe briefly.)
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby shadowdemon » Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:33 am

First of all, I 'd like to point out that Tramennis's signamancy has been changing. He's getting taller, more regal. Compare a picture of him in the bridge fight to now to see what I mean. Also, I gotta position myself against the whole "Ace will turn sides" deal. Ace is the perfect way to make Jet Stone still be a credible threat to GK after the taking of Spacerock. GK isn't going to know what hit it when the next Jet Stone city they lay seige to is defended by infantry with rifles. Suddenly that whole flying advantage the Dwagons have wont look so hot...
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby atalex » Thu Mar 03, 2011 2:54 am

kreszantas wrote:
Ok, well that to you is the in the eye of the beholder again. Do you even know who and how this all got started? Well a group called the Chicago Boys decided to do a little "field economic experiment" those boys had to practically dismantle the old economy to restore it to a "USA" friendly economy meaning removing the Socialist aspects from it. This experiment is the basis of what Obama is now doing only in reverse to the USA... makes you wonder now does it. The Chileain example was actually used as a South American model that it can succeed but it had a higher cost than was expected. I am not excusing or an apologist for Pinochet merely stating at it related to the economy and that alone and it should stick to just that.


If you plan to derail this thread by making what I consider the moronic claim that Obama is a Socialist , please let me know now, so I can go ahead and foe you.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby BakaGrappler » Thu Mar 03, 2011 4:25 am

shadowdemon wrote:First of all, I 'd like to point out that Tramennis's signamancy has been changing. He's getting taller, more regal. Compare a picture of him in the bridge fight to now to see what I mean. Also, I gotta position myself against the whole "Ace will turn sides" deal. Ace is the perfect way to make Jet Stone still be a credible threat to GK after the taking of Spacerock. GK isn't going to know what hit it when the next Jet Stone city they lay seige to is defended by infantry with rifles. Suddenly that whole flying advantage the Dwagons have wont look so hot...


I think you're forgetting something that has changed the entire playing field now.

The King is going into battle.

When a unit is completely convinced that his ruler is going against what is best for himself and his Side as a whole he can disobey an order and not be disbanded. Ace is just wild enough to decide, "Damnnit! I've just gotta do somethin'!" He may even get Pierce's okay on it, since it would be an effort to save lives. That would get Ace with his Jetpack running back into the castle, slapping the jet pack onto his ruler, pushing the button and slingshotting his king out of the city's zone. And since Ossomer is getting all cuddly on us, he may decide to "Not Risk" the Archons and decline to go after his suddenly flight capable father.

This would get Ace in GK hands, setting him up for Turning, making Slately feel even more like a heel for treating Ace like crap just for missing Dolly, and keep Slately from being decrypted.

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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby Althernai » Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:54 am

GaryThunder wrote:Top-level warlords don't seem to lose against any opponent but other top-level warlords, commanded dwagons, or similar huge threats. I'd say they're not at that much risk, usually.

Bogroll took out Ansom and we know the twoll was much lower level because he leveled twice just from that single act. I think they're pretty safe from low level units in ordinary situations, but we've seen plenty of things that can take croak, capture or incapacitate them -- special items, large mounts, casters, siege -- so they're hardly safe.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby Smoker » Thu Mar 03, 2011 9:04 am

Althernai wrote:
GaryThunder wrote:Top-level warlords don't seem to lose against any opponent but other top-level warlords, commanded dwagons, or similar huge threats. I'd say they're not at that much risk, usually.

Bogroll took out Ansom and we know the twoll was much lower level because he leveled twice just from that single act. I think they're pretty safe from low level units in ordinary situations, but we've seen plenty of things that can take croak, capture or incapacitate them -- special items, large mounts, casters, siege -- so they're hardly safe.


You forgot plot :)
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby teratorn » Thu Mar 03, 2011 10:29 am

Althernai wrote:Bogroll took out Ansom and we know the twoll was much lower level because he leveled twice just from that single act. I think they're pretty safe from low level units in ordinary situations, but we've seen plenty of things that can take croak, capture or incapacitate them -- special items, large mounts, casters, siege -- so they're hardly safe.


Yes, but Ansom probably lost most of his hitpoints from the fall and not from damage from Bogroll.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby justamessenger » Thu Mar 03, 2011 11:26 am

teratorn wrote:
Althernai wrote:Bogroll took out Ansom and we know the twoll was much lower level because he leveled twice just from that single act. I think they're pretty safe from low level units in ordinary situations, but we've seen plenty of things that can take croak, capture or incapacitate them -- special items, large mounts, casters, siege -- so they're hardly safe.


Yes, but Ansom probably lost most of his hitpoints from the fall and not from damage from Bogroll.


Mr. Owl, how many licks does it take for a twoll to kill a high level Warlord?

A one, a twohoooo, a three...thud...a three...

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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby GaryThunder » Thu Mar 03, 2011 12:42 pm

Bogroll wasn't really attacking Ansom so much as he was just making him fall. He swatted the Arkenpliers out of Ansom's hand, because that's probably a one-hit kill, but then he just lunged and grabbed Ansom by the throat as they fell.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby drachefly » Thu Mar 03, 2011 12:45 pm

shadowdemon wrote: Also, I gotta position myself against the whole "Ace will turn sides" deal.


Everyone else named after a hardware or tool company attuned (Stanleytools.com, Wandasnapon.com, charlestool.com). Compare that to googling, say, Dora tools, Vinnie tools, Caesar tools, Ansom tools (note, Google will redirect you to Anson tools, which is a company, but is not Ansom). Anyone else with a vaguely realistic hardware store name?

Oh yeah, Ace. And as a bright flashing sign, his last name is freaking 'Hardware'. He's going to attune to something, eventually. And by Wanda's prophecy, that puts him, similarly eventually, on the same side as all the others. Eventually. Doesn't need to be today.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby the_tick_rules » Thu Mar 03, 2011 12:59 pm

There is only one other known arkentool and we dunno what it is, so guessing is really hard to do.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby Lamech » Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:48 pm

Clearly the last arkentool will be the arkenprograms. Ace is the hardware to run it.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby Sieggy » Thu Mar 03, 2011 2:51 pm

teratorn wrote:
Althernai wrote:Bogroll took out Ansom and we know the twoll was much lower level because he leveled twice just from that single act. I think they're pretty safe from low level units in ordinary situations, but we've seen plenty of things that can take croak, capture or incapacitate them -- special items, large mounts, casters, siege -- so they're hardly safe.


Yes, but Ansom probably lost most of his hitpoints from the fall and not from damage from Bogroll.

Not to mention the previous damage suffered during the action on top of the walls (getting blasted off the carpet by ZomboWebinar, falling, getting swarmed by uncroaked, etc). You could tell he was injured because of his tattered Evel Knievel outfit and missing tooth . . .
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby BCCroaker » Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:56 pm

I'd like to point out that Slately may not make it out to lead the last charge. He makes Tram heir, but that takes so much time that Sylvia uses the purple dwagons to destroy the tower with him in it, and that ends him and a substantial portion of Jetstones troops. No farewells, leaving Tram to wonder what his father meant by this. Throw in Ossomer and get confusion and plot developement. The love in the Jetstone royal family for each other being the battlefield here.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby GaryThunder » Thu Mar 03, 2011 9:47 pm

Not to mention the previous damage suffered during the action on top of the walls (getting blasted off the carpet by ZomboWebinar, falling, getting swarmed by uncroaked, etc). You could tell he was injured because of his tattered Evel Knievel outfit and missing tooth . . .


Ansom falls a lot, doesn't he. Fell onto the wall, fell when Bogroll knocked him off his carpet, fell when Ossomer knocked him off his carpet.
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Re: Book 2 – Text Updates 042

Postby Oberon » Thu Mar 03, 2011 10:12 pm

GaryThunder wrote:Ansom falls a lot, doesn't he. Fell onto the wall, fell when Bogroll knocked him off his carpet, fell when Ossomer knocked him off his carpet.
Three falls, and none fatal. HAX!
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