Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby BLANDCorporatio » Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:20 pm

Swodaems wrote:Next turn, if MarbitChow eats the corpse and levels to grillphon, will the amount of move he has remaining increase by 2?


Yep.
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby Swodaems » Wed Jul 25, 2012 5:11 pm

BLANDCorporatio wrote:
Swodaems wrote:Next turn, if MarbitChow eats the corpse and levels to grillphon, will the amount of move he has remaining increase by 2?


Yep.

Alright, if we so choose, we can get 7 of the 8 PCs and the NPC Sprite to the mine this turn.

We need make a few group decisions before we move out.
1. Are we sure we actually want to rush the mine as a group, instead of hitting another target like the ruins or the Wolves? We do have the option to pop and send a small NPC force to reclaim the mine instead.
2. If we do go to the mine as a large group, which of the melee units gets left out of the mine group?
3. Does the melee unit getting left out out of the group do anything? (We could pop some units for him to use to explore the ruins or to attack the wolves. We may even be able to send him as an envoy to the Bwussels?)
4. Do we want to try peaceful relations with the Burgers? (I'm thinking we should talk to both the Bwussels and the Burgers before picking a side in this conflict. That's why I'm suggesting capturing the Burger Bee intruder instead of flat out croaking it.)
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby Werebiscuit » Wed Jul 25, 2012 5:58 pm

Swodaems wrote:We need make a few group decisions before we move out.

I agree it has to be a group decision because I believe it will affect our PC turns for a few turns to come as I believe the Burger Bee was not alone. I'll tell you my reasoning....
Why would they damage the mad cow if not as a prelude to an attack on it ? Would they then send a single Jolly Bee to attack ?
I have no doubt that the Jolly be is a scout for a party to take out the mad cow. We will be needing to negotiate from a position of strength with whatever force they have sent
Swodaems wrote:1. Are we sure we actually want to rush the mine as a group, instead of hitting another target like the ruins or the Wolves? We do have the option to pop and send a small NPC force to reclaim the mine instead.

They have already seen our manager and a Jolly Bee take out the mad cow (we assume) and still they sent their Jolly Bee to see where our group went. They then claimed the mine even though it would have been marked as ours. If they have seen the Mad cow and now the mine they also most likely know of the abandoned city site and it's defenders. We need to make sure it's our city site before they arrive especially if we want to negotiate. That means whatever group takes the mine back has to then take the city site. Could we pop a small NPC group capable of that ? We can take the site and have NPC's defend it if we want to take on Ruins or Wolves etc. but we NEED a strong group to visibly take it, to put them off taking it from us once we have it.
Swodaems wrote:2. If we do go to the mine as a large group, which of the melee units gets left out of the mine group?

Very good question but which ever unit is left will get to the mine the following turn and then get a ride and thus protection for the Barberian/Hare Stylist fight so all they will have missed is 5 xp split 8 ways and that's only if we kill the Burger Bee. I'm suggesting we follow Swodaems suggestion and stun & capture it. It might give us a bargaining chip.
Swodaems wrote:3. Does the melee unit getting left out out of the group do anything? (We could pop some units for him to use to explore the ruins or to attack the wolves. We may even be able to send him as an envoy to the Bwussels?)

We don't know how far away Bwussels is, only the direction. I wouldn't ask a PC to take on that job. I'm suggesting we pop NPC's to serve for that purpose and also as guards for the abandoned city site once we take it. The Unit left out of the mine fight will only be maximum 3 hexes behind and can make the mine the following turn and then get a ride to the city site fight.
Swodaems wrote:4. Do we want to try peaceful relations with the Burgers? (I'm thinking we should talk to both the Bwussels and the Burgers before picking a side in this conflict. That's why I'm suggesting capturing the Burger Bee intruder instead of flat out croaking it.)

I'm in agreement with the capture but if we're negotiating we already want to have possession of the city site and a force to keep it. Remember they took our mine and they know it
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby MarbitChow » Wed Jul 25, 2012 6:52 pm

BLAND : Are turns sequential or simultaneous? I got the impression that the Bear attacked the Duo on our turn, before we ended it, but I could be entirely mistaken.

Rest of the team : we might be able to use the mine as a trap. Spawn and send a single low-level unit to take the mine back, then hang back in reserve to see what takes the mine over next, and hit THAT with our large group, once we see its composition. We can honestly claim to be protecting our turf, and start negotiations from a position of strength.

Also, I'm hungry, and that bear is looking mighty tasty.

BLAND : Do units that eat the corpses of enemy forces gain knowledge from those bodies, or just "experience"?
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby Werebiscuit » Thu Jul 26, 2012 4:18 am

MarbitChow wrote:Rest of the team : we might be able to use the mine as a trap. Spawn and send a single low-level unit to take the mine back, then hang back in reserve to see what takes the mine over next, and hit THAT with our large group, once we see its composition. We can honestly claim to be protecting our turf, and start negotiations from a position of strength.]


I had thought of possibly doing it like that BUT if we hang back we need to take the city site next turn, to stop them having it before negotiations. If they then re-take the mine while we're taking the city site, they will have killed one of our units , or worse take it capture. They will either have a counter bargaining chip or no position to negotiate.
If we go in in force, I'm hoping it stops them from considering re-taking the mine.

There is also he possibility that they have already taken the city site, or will take it as we re-capture the mine. We cannot then claim to be protecting our turf if we want the city site in this case . AND I believe we don't want a Burger city so close to our own. So we HAVE to have the city site.

I'm not saying that we can't or don't do it the way you proposed but if we wait for them to re-take the mine we rely on our force being overwhelmingly superior to theirs such that we can take it back again without difficulty. If we already have the mine and our forces are matched or superior then it gives them pause about taking the mine. If their force is superior then we can't take the mine back if they have it but if we already have it we can then negotiate whilst bringing in backup. That's why we need to take it in force. If we can capture the Burger Bee while doing it so much the better.

I want to let the rest of the group decide which way they want to do it as it affects our position with the Burgers.
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby BLANDCorporatio » Thu Jul 26, 2012 7:04 am

MarbitChow wrote:BLAND : Are turns sequential or simultaneous? I got the impression that the Bear attacked the Duo on our turn, before we ended it, but I could be entirely mistaken.


Sequential. There was an "end turn" action before the bear attack.

MarbitChow wrote:BLAND : Do units that eat the corpses of enemy forces gain knowledge from those bodies, or just "experience"?


To make things easier on myself, it will be just a vague "experience" that's absorbed, roughly corresponding to practical knowledge and skills ("knowing how") and not factual knowledge on the side from which the unit came.
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby BLANDCorporatio » Thu Jul 26, 2012 7:21 am

On politics: so far, nobody knew you existed, so you can suppose they start mostly neutral towards you.

Some things to keep in mind.

You look exactly like the Burgers, which may puzzle them, and might make the Vegge Talians, should they see you, regard you with hostility.

This being Erfworld, what starts neutral may easily degenerate into hostile if the others think they risk little by doing so. Some bluffing at this stage is one way to go.
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby The Colonel » Thu Jul 26, 2012 7:30 am

IDEA!

When stuff goes south, get the Starchild to eat a few Vegge Talians and pop some lookalikes.
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby BLANDCorporatio » Thu Jul 26, 2012 7:36 am

The Colonel wrote:IDEA!

When stuff goes south, get the Starchild to eat a few Vegge Talians and pop some lookalikes.


That could actually work.
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby Swodaems » Thu Jul 26, 2012 8:03 am

BLANDCorporatio wrote:
MarbitChow wrote:BLAND : Are turns sequential or simultaneous? I got the impression that the Bear attacked the Duo on our turn, before we ended it, but I could be entirely mistaken.


Sequential. There was an "end turn" action before the bear attack.
Then I have to ask exactly where I am. If the bear attacked us, I cannot be where it used to be. That's where I am shown on the latest map. I would have to be one hex to either the NE or SE. (Either option doesn't affect our ability to get 8 of our 9 units to the mine this turn. Myself and NPC Sprite just have to travel to the meetup hex and the mine by different routes.)
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby BLANDCorporatio » Thu Jul 26, 2012 8:05 am

Swodaems wrote:
BLANDCorporatio wrote:
MarbitChow wrote:BLAND : Are turns sequential or simultaneous? I got the impression that the Bear attacked the Duo on our turn, before we ended it, but I could be entirely mistaken.


Sequential. There was an "end turn" action before the bear attack.
Then I have to ask exactly where I am. If the bear attacked us, I cannot be where it used to be. That's where I am shown on the latest map. I would have to be one hex to either the NE or SE. (Either option doesn't affect our ability to get 8 of our 9 units to the mine this turn. Myself and NPC Sprite just have to travel to the meetup hex and the mine by different routes.)


Correct, NE then it is. I'll fix that soon.
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby Swodaems » Thu Jul 26, 2012 9:02 am

MarbitChow wrote:BLAND : Are turns sequential or simultaneous? I got the impression that the Bear attacked the Duo on our turn, before we ended it, but I could be entirely mistaken.

Rest of the team : we might be able to use the mine as a trap. Spawn and send a single low-level unit to take the mine back, then hang back in reserve to see what takes the mine over next, and hit THAT with our large group, once we see its composition. We can honestly claim to be protecting our turf, and start negotiations from a position of strength.
I think that we would be better off defending the mine than we would be trying to remove a force from it. The mine offers a 10% damage reduction to the force that holds it.

BLANDCorporatio wrote:Correct, NE then it is. I'll fix that soon.
In that case, I have a path to the mine that only uses up 6 of my 10 move and NPC Sprite only needs to travel 2 hexes NE to get to the meetup point.

Updated Plan:
Our migration to the mine starts with me seperating from NPC Bee and going by myself to deal with the Burger Bee. (Seeing as the Burgers have not merely violated our territory, but actively hindered us by taking the mine, I'll first offer the Burger Bee a chance to surrender and, if he refuses, use stun attacks to beat him senseless.)
Next, NPC Sprite drags the Grizzled Bear corpse 2 hexes NE to the hex 2 hexes NW of the capital.
Then the house group and Bob Enweave move to meet up with NPC sprite, but act oddly on the way: First, the house group move 2 hexes NW to meet up with Bob Enweave. MarbitChow mounts Bob Enweave. The whole group, now with Bob Enweave, moves 1 hex NW into our capital. MarbitChow dismounts and 0beron gets on. Then the group moves the remaining 2 hexes NW to NPC Sprite's location. (This way, MarbitChow saves 2 move and Oberon saves 4 move.)
MarbitChow eats the Grizzled bear corpse and levels to grillphon. 0beron dismounts. We choose any two of the three (EtheBoyce, TheColonel, and Watermonkey314) melee units to mount on Bob Enweave and MarbitChow. (Whoever is left behind will have the move next turn to be able to join the group assaulting the city.)
Thanks to the mount/dismount shenanigans and the choice of meeting place, NPC Sprite, Bob Enweave, MarbitChow, Bridget, and 0beron should all have the move remaining to get to the mine this turn with the 2 chosen melee units riding along.
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby Werebiscuit » Thu Jul 26, 2012 9:29 am

Swodaems wrote:I think that we would be better off defending the mine than we would be trying to remove a force from it. The mine offers a 10% damage reduction to the force that holds it.

I agree. But not merely for the damage reduction ( see other reasons above)

Swodaems wrote: I have a path to the mine that only uses up 6 of my 10 move and NPC Sprite only needs to travel 2 hexes NE to get to the meetup point.

Updated Plan:
Our migration to the mine starts with me seperating from NPC Bee and going by myself to deal with the Burger Bee. (Seeing as the Burgers have not merely violated our territory, but actively hindered us by taking the mine, I'll first offer the Burger Bee a chance to surrender and, if he refuses, use stun attacks to beat him senseless.)
Next, NPC Sprite drags the Grizzled Bear corpse 2 hexes NE to the hex 2 hexes NW of the capital.
Then the house group and Bob Enweave move to meet up with NPC sprite, but act oddly on the way: First, the house group move 2 hexes NW to meet up with Bob Enweave. MarbitChow mounts Bob Enweave. The whole group, now with Bob Enweave, moves 1 hex NW into our capital. MarbitChow dismounts and 0beron gets on. Then the group moves the remaining 2 hexes NW to NPC Sprite's location. (This way, MarbitChow saves 2 move and Oberon saves 4 move.)
MarbitChow eats the Grizzled bear corpse and levels to grillphon. 0beron dismounts. We choose any two of the three (EtheBoyce, TheColonel, and Watermonkey314) melee units to mount on Bob Enweave and MarbitChow. (Whoever is left behind will have the move next turn to be able to join the group assaulting the city.)
Thanks to the mount/dismount shenanigans and the choice of meeting place, NPC Sprite, Bob Enweave, MarbitChow, Bridget, and 0beron should all have the move remaining to get to the mine this turn with the 2 chosen melee units riding along.


Why do you need to go to deal with the Burger Bee yourself ? Have you considered that there may be Burger forces arriving to bolster a non-damage-dealing unit holding a recently taken piece of rival territory ? Why not wait for us and arrive in a formidable unit ?
We can still use diplomacy and/or beat the Burger bee senseless if their reinforcements don't arrive.
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby The Colonel » Thu Jul 26, 2012 9:35 am

TALK TO THE BURGERS, WE LOOK LIKE EM! AND TALK TO THE VEGGIES AFTER WE LEARN HOW TO POP LOOKALIKES, SEND THE LOOKALIKE TO TALK
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby Swodaems » Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:26 am

Werebiscuit wrote:
Swodaems wrote:I think that we would be better off defending the mine than we would be trying to remove a force from it. The mine offers a 10% damage reduction to the force that holds it.

I agree. But not merely for the damage reduction ( see other reasons above)

Swodaems wrote: I have a path to the mine that only uses up 6 of my 10 move and NPC Sprite only needs to travel 2 hexes NE to get to the meetup point.

Updated Plan:
Our migration to the mine starts with me seperating from NPC Bee and going by myself to deal with the Burger Bee. (Seeing as the Burgers have not merely violated our territory, but actively hindered us by taking the mine, I'll first offer the Burger Bee a chance to surrender and, if he refuses, use stun attacks to beat him senseless.)
Next, NPC Sprite drags the Grizzled Bear corpse 2 hexes NE to the hex 2 hexes NW of the capital.
Then the house group and Bob Enweave move to meet up with NPC sprite, but act oddly on the way: First, the house group move 2 hexes NW to meet up with Bob Enweave. MarbitChow mounts Bob Enweave. The whole group, now with Bob Enweave, moves 1 hex NW into our capital. MarbitChow dismounts and 0beron gets on. Then the group moves the remaining 2 hexes NW to NPC Sprite's location. (This way, MarbitChow saves 2 move and Oberon saves 4 move.)
MarbitChow eats the Grizzled bear corpse and levels to grillphon. 0beron dismounts. We choose any two of the three (EtheBoyce, TheColonel, and Watermonkey314) melee units to mount on Bob Enweave and MarbitChow. (Whoever is left behind will have the move next turn to be able to join the group assaulting the city.)
Thanks to the mount/dismount shenanigans and the choice of meeting place, NPC Sprite, Bob Enweave, MarbitChow, Bridget, and 0beron should all have the move remaining to get to the mine this turn with the 2 chosen melee units riding along.


Why do you need to go to deal with the Burger Bee yourself ? Have you considered that there may be Burger forces arriving to bolster a non-damage-dealing unit holding a recently taken piece of rival territory ? Why not wait for us and arrive in a formidable unit ?
We can still use diplomacy and/or beat the Burger bee senseless if their reinforcements don't arrive.
BLAND, would we have seen any reinforcements arrive? Could the Burgers have forces on the map that we can't see? I have my character dealing with the Burger Bee by myself because I thought it doesn't matter. NPC Sprite and 6PCs will be joining me at the mine within the same turn as I deal with the bee. So long as there are no hidden enemies, I'm not seperated long enough to give them a chance to attack me. (However, from my new position, so long as I don't help the NPC Sprite drag the corpse, I can travel 2 hexes NE to the meetup hex and move with the party to the mine.)
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby 0beron » Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:29 am

Swodaems wrote:BLAND, would we have seen any reinforcements arrive? Could the Burgers have forces on the map that we can't see?

I can answer those for you easily. If we don't see anything else now and he didn't mention it to us, then we don't see it. Knowing more would be metagame. And yes of COURSE there COULD be other forces on the map we can't see, either because they're out of out line of sight, or Foolamanced.
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby BLANDCorporatio » Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:36 am

0beron's answer is correct. What you have in your visible range is what you have direct knowledge of.

Without straying too much into meta, I'll add that assuming there to be some Burger stack near the Bee is plausible, and one could either reason that it's not a particularly strong force (if it decided to bomb a Mad Cow with spells and so far has avoided the city zone) or that spells are cheap and they don't mind 'wasting' them on small critters.
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby Werebiscuit » Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:51 am

BLANDCorporatio wrote:0beron's answer is correct. What you have in your visible range is what you have direct knowledge of.

Without straying too much into meta, I'll add that assuming there to be some Burger stack near the Bee is plausible, and one could either reason that it's not a particularly strong force (if it decided to bomb a Mad Cow with spells and so far has avoided the city zone) or that spells are cheap and they don't mind 'wasting' them on small critters.

Mmmh..hmmm... and one could argue, like I did, that it's stong enough to contemplate taking a rival mine after it has possibly seen a rival Manager and Jolly bee stack dispose of its mad cow target nearby.
Of course, they could just be ballsy. Sending a lone jolly Bee to the mine was indeed a ballsy move.
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby Werebiscuit » Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:40 am

We can also presume they have a caster since we presume the Mad cow was damaged with a spell.

The Starchild gets 90% experioence from casters Question Bland : would that allow us to pop caster units if we feed him to the Starchild ?
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Re: Disciples of Erfworld - The Contagion - rules and signup

Postby 0beron » Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:44 am

It does mean they have a caster (something we could have assumed given their size/power level) but we already know spells can be called like air strikes from (presumably) unlimited range in this game, so the caster that damaged the Mad Cow may be dozens of hexes away :(
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