4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby Werebiscuit » Mon Aug 13, 2012 11:50 am

Olive's Chillaxe for the 4th tool ? A bit of foreshadowing perhaps ? I don't think we've seen the chillaxe have we ? Only read of it.

Probably not a good theory as there's no tool connections beyond the axe but it's there to be shot down nonetheless.
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby 0beron » Mon Aug 13, 2012 11:58 am

It's possible, but it doesn't quite jibe.
The calm spell she did with the Chillaxe (while powerful) didn't quite seem 'Tool-worthy. Of course, this could just mean Olive isn't attuned to it, and is just wielding it like Ansom did with the 'Plier. However, if she's not attuned, then the idea of her using it and somehow screwing up Haffaton isn't possible. The 2 are kinda mutually exclusive in my opinion.
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby Nnelg » Mon Aug 13, 2012 5:56 pm

Well, if attunement isn't something that reoccurs (as in, the only attuned are those Fated to remake Erf) then Olive couldn't have been attuned (unless Rob pulls a twist and she survives the fall of Haffaton).

Maybe she isn't attuned to it, but tries to "fix" that somehow... Then her failed attempt to forcibly master a 'Tool could be what brought Haffaton to its knees.
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby 0beron » Mon Aug 13, 2012 6:32 pm

Well that opens up a whole different thread of speculation. I'm of the opinion that multiple characters could be attuned (Partially because I feel that Stanley is not the final intended wielder of the 'Hammer). But you're right, even if mutliple users could be attuned, Olive could have not been one of them and tried.
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby Selexor » Mon Aug 20, 2012 1:27 am

That could be possible. I suspect there are also multiple "Potentials" out there who can Attune to a tool at the same time. I always had a suspicion that this comic suggested that Sylvia was about to Attune to the Arkenpliers before the Volcano croaked her. The way she mentions its power to the recently-uncroaked Ossomer...
"Do you remember the sense of the divine? Did you feel that your hands were in contact with something greater than the world?" she asked. She turned her head and looked into the featureless distance. "The Arkentools were used to build the world. I wielded the Arkenpliers, and had the feeling that they could build more worlds than only this one. Their power was primal, undeniable, and very strange."

...suggests to me that she tuned in to their power far more than many other units could have. It's even possible (though unfounded) that there are varying levels of Attunement. That's the school of thought that says, were Stanley a Caster, he'd be able to wield the Arkenhammer more effectively. He may not have unlocked its true potential yet, given how much more powerful the Arkendish and the Arkenpliers seem to be.

So it's possible that Olive found the Fourth Arkentool. As a Grand Abbie, she may have been able to comprehend that it held a connection to Signamancy, and decided that she had power over it. And, attuned or not, decided that made her its worthy wielder. Whether she then attempted to tap into Retconjuration, or whether she tried to use the Arkentool before it was ready and was summarily Retconjured out of existence, could vary. Hell, she might not even have tried to. If "Form = Function" for Signamancy, then perhaps her idea was to channel the power of Erfworld itself into Haffaton. Which would mean Haffaton's Signamancy would be that of Erfworld itself - in other words, she dispersed her side into the very form of Erfworld, the backfire causing her spell to have the exact opposite effect than she intended, and erasing them from existence.
But of course that's just my opinion.
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby Whispri » Mon Sep 10, 2012 4:45 pm

drachefly wrote:Fine. Nothing I've read indicates that Jetstone never bordered Haffaton. GK could have been around then, and bordered them.

What's so bad about this? Why would you expect Haffaton to be such a topic of conversation that it must have come up by now?

Haffaton has absorbed all of Faq's neighbours save for Translyvito. Future era Gobwin Knob will be Faq's neighbour. So then, Haffaton control at least part of Stanley's present Domain. While they may not be right on top of Jetstone, they're close enough for ground warfare to be waged.

Well for one thing, the Lady Wanda Firebaugh, Haffaton's famous Croakamancer, who was said to be responsible for most of their conquests and who may well have destroyed more Sides than Jetstone has Cities has arrived at Jetstone leading an army of the dead. That's really not the sort of thing that slides past without comment.

So then, something is going to happen that either stops Jillian from gaining Levels for a period of time sufficiently vast for Haffaton to pass from living memory (bear in mind that Faq was going to run out of money within thirty odd turns of Jillian abandoning her usual work), or something is going to happen that causes Haffaton to swiftly disappear and be forgotten. Given the bit at the very start of Book Zero about the terrible debt to be payed for bringing Wanda into existence, I'm favouring the latter.
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby Arky » Tue Sep 11, 2012 2:38 am

I'm sure Parson must have asked about it off-screen (the same as I'm sure he's asked about all the magic disciplines off-screen).

As for Stanley and Wanda, they seem focussed first on crushing the RCC and consolidating the empire of Gobwin Knob before they try to take the next Arkentool. The fact we haven't heard either of them talking about invading X to grab the Arkensaw (or whatever) isn't any more surprising than that we haven't seen them talk about locating and invading Charlescomm. It is also presumably far away enough (or lost enough) that no-one is bothering to factor its holder into the Toolism debate at the moment. Perhaps it is meant to be at the far other end of Erfworld.
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby WaterMonkey314 » Thu Sep 13, 2012 11:44 pm

This is a hugely random question, but has the MK ever been mentioned in IPTSF? If not, we might have an interesting connection between Wanda's garden, the 4th Arkentool, and the mysterious things powering the portals.
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby Lamech » Fri Sep 14, 2012 12:54 am

WaterMonkey314 wrote:This is a hugely random question, but has the MK ever been mentioned in IPTSF? If not, we might have an interesting connection between Wanda's garden, the 4th Arkentool, and the mysterious things powering the portals.

Yes, yes it has. Wanda was there. Unless Wanda has a secret stash of retconomancy she didn't make the MK. That said, I wouldn't be surprised if the garden is in some similar area to the MK.
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby Werebiscuit » Fri Sep 14, 2012 6:59 am

WaterMonkey314 wrote:This is a hugely random question, but has the MK ever been mentioned in IPTSF? If not, we might have an interesting connection between Wanda's garden, the 4th Arkentool, and the mysterious things powering the portals.


THe MK is mentioned in episode 9 when Delphie tells Wanda of a meeting between herself and Olive Branch that took place in the neutrality of the MK. Wanda eventually goes to the MK herself in episode 21. So the portals are there before Wanda creates her garden.
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby WaterMonkey314 » Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:51 pm

Werebiscuit wrote:
WaterMonkey314 wrote:This is a hugely random question, but has the MK ever been mentioned in IPTSF? If not, we might have an interesting connection between Wanda's garden, the 4th Arkentool, and the mysterious things powering the portals.


THe MK is mentioned in episode 9 when Delphie tells Wanda of a meeting between herself and Olive Branch that took place in the neutrality of the MK. Wanda eventually goes to the MK herself in episode 21. So the portals are there before Wanda creates her garden.


Right, of course! I figured I was probably just being absent-minded and forgetting it. :P
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby Selexor » Fri Feb 01, 2013 4:27 am

Well, that's the fourth tool revealed.

I was obviously wrong about the theory that it would be a musical instrument or an artist's tool. But if the Signamancy theory holds out, shoes could still be Signamancy-related. Keeping the wearer grounded and able to percieve things the way they are, giving them balance. Perhaps a more defensive Arkentool than the Arkenhammer's obvious weapon status, or the Arkendish and the Arkenpliers providing more of a support mechanism - the Arkenshoes seem to have helped Judy to regain her mind and her strength despite the power of the Heroine Buds, after all. Jack specifically noted that the Buds seemed to be using a strange form of Foolamancy, and Signamancy seems to be the natural counter to that (Foolamancy disguises something's true nature, while Signamancy reveals it).

In the movie the shoes obviously were of great magical power, and they were used to unlock the obvious power that Dorothy had all along, so that could definitely show an attunement to Signamancy. On the other hand, perhaps the Arkenshoes are related to Healomancy; it's also Fate-aligned, so it fits the bill. If the Arkenshoes can restore Judy to power and repair the damage done by the Heroine Buds, perhaps they can be used as an all-purpose Healing spell, detecting and removing all negative conditions, or just an all-powerful Resist Magic effect. That'd be just as powerful as the other Arkentools if used correctly - a caster weilding the Arkenshoes would be all but unkillable if screened from melee attacks.

Either way, it looks like very soon we're about to see what the Arkenshoes are capable of, if Judy truly is going to put Olive in her place. It'll be fun to see how many theories from this thread are horribly, horribly wrong (my money is on all of them).
But of course that's just my opinion.
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby 0beron » Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:48 am

Yeah, we've seen that the forms of the 'Tools are at best only loosely related to their function, so it's not surprising/discouraging for me to see the 'Shoes. They could definitely still be Signamancy, but regardless I'm excited to see what they do in the next few updates.
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Re: 4th Arkentool covers Signamancy?

Postby gameboy1234 » Sat Feb 02, 2013 5:59 pm

Just noticed this thread: we have four tools. Two are closely aligned with magic. One seems to be more of a weapon. Sure it has Shockmancy and tames dwagons, but it seems very much a thing for hitting enemies with.

So it seems probable to me that the Arkenshoes will have some effect not directly related to 'mancy. Possibly more defensive or peace oriented, to balance the Arkenhammer's war-like abilities. Sure, there will be magical effects, but the shoes are not going to primarily boost a magical discipline. They'll be more tool-like, something almost anyone could use.

Plus I want to see Parson in red high-heel pumps.
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