Book 2 – Page 91

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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby Oberon » Thu Oct 04, 2012 2:01 pm

joosy wrote:
Kalak wrote:A really good way to trap him would be to switch capitals to Jetstone before he gets through. At the rate Parson moves through MK, that might be pretty feasable.
Yes, but then Parson will probably just go back to GK.
I like Kalak's plan. Unless there's some way for a unit in the MK to tell where a portal goes, Parson and any casters stacked with him (at least Wanda and Jack) would pass through after the change expecting to be in Spacerock but would be in Jetstone the city. Spacely could use his natural thinkamancy to send units into the portal room to ...greet... them.

I think this is a far better plan than hoping to kill Parson and company with what remains of the Spacerock defenses, since by storming the throne room rather than the garrison they are likely to all be in chains very quickly after Parson and company come though and finish the garrison cleanup. Remember, all the prevents the fall of Spacerock is an unconscious Cubbins. Surely a pile of casters will have some way of detecting and killing him. And then all the remaining (thousands?) of Jetstone units are in chains, very quickly to become upkeep free decrypted for GK.
joosy wrote:I would guess that it costs very little [to switch capitals] as Jetstone is about to do it with their meager treasury.
Slately seemed surprised at the size of the gem. It probably covers his capitol swapping fees as well as the crowning of Trem.
sheepfly wrote:Also, it's hard to see how changing the capital would change ANYTHING. Sure, the portal closes. If GK takes the garrison, the exact same thing would happen.
Agreed.
Sharik wrote:The truth of your statement rather depends on how many archons Charlie has quietly stashed somewhere within a turn or two's move of Spacerock...
I think you mean GK. Taking on the GK forces in Spacerock could easily be a much tougher proposition than a decapitation strike on Stanley, given that the wealth of offensive casters will be there. GK doesn't even have the decrypted archons screening its airspace, and they have in the past spotted and killed/decrypted CharlesComm archons who were trying to pass through GK battlespace.
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Beeskee wrote:Unfortunately it's sort of like locking yourself in a cage with a bear. HAH. You've got him now. Well, yes, yes you do.
Actually, it's more like locking yourself in a phonebooth with a sniper. Parson is a planner, not a fighter.
He fought and killed in the final battle for GK. Makes me wish we had some hints dropped about any levels he may have gained. In the Jetstone garrison battle we saw Wanda's lone guard level twice with just a few kills.
MonteCristo wrote:Before much of this went down, Tramennis was considering a ceasefire and setting up a non-aggression pact. And how did that end? Parson took advantage of the parley to turn the tide of battle against them. Quite frankly, Parson has proven himself poisonous to negotiate with in the mist of battle.
Hmmm, not quite. Tram refused to parley with the appointed GK negotiator and insisted on speaking to Parson himself. Then GK attacked. That's not to say things would have gone differently, but when you reject a spokesperson for no good reason it doesn't give much confidence to the other side that you plan to negotiate in good faith. Plus, wasn't the Jetstone plan to offer conditions GK would have had to refuse anyway? Wanda, and the pliers, plus a huge amount of schmuckers? All to let the dwagons fly out again? They thought they had their feet to the fire and were going to negotiate from that position of strength. Parson's 'treachery' let them understand just how mistaken they were. Tram quickly went from planning to demand more schmuckers for the damage to the garrison to trying to get Slately to fly away before the side fell.
Zeroberon wrote:"Oh well ya see our Ruler just croaked, making me Ruler now...oh and there goes the Capital. Too bad this other capital site I'm sitting in is useless."
There may be a difference between voluntarily swapping capitol sites and re-establishing a capitol site when you have none at present.
Last edited by Oberon on Thu Oct 04, 2012 2:09 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby Pindanin » Thu Oct 04, 2012 2:01 pm

I have my own pet theory.

Hamstard will go through the portal and Jetstone will switch capitals trapping Hamstard. Hamstard with Wanda will decrypt all of the Jetstone dead and kill Tram. Ending thier side (no heir popping after all). Charlie will then kill Hamstard.

The bat will communicate all of this back to Don who will then sing the praises of Charlie....who is then back in business.
Don would also be able to confirm that Charlie GAVE them money to TRY and save Jetstone but the evil GK still managed to do it. Charlie will say he would have saved Jetstone but they refused to ally with him and that cost them thier side.

However a part of me wants to believe that Charlie wants Hamstard captured and on his side. AND Wanda alive. With Wanda still alive GK is still a huge threat but Charlie being back in the good graces of the royals he can charge even more bucks and make even more profit. This is why he is giving money to jetstone....it's just a small investment for a big return.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby 0beron » Thu Oct 04, 2012 2:06 pm

Oberon wrote:
Zeroberon wrote:"Oh well ya see our Ruler just croaked, making me Ruler now...oh and there goes the Capital. Too bad this other capital site I'm sitting in is useless."
There may be a difference between voluntarily swapping capitol sites and re-establishing a capitol site when you have none at present.

Agreed, this is what I am hoping/assuming must be the case.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby Oberon » Thu Oct 04, 2012 2:17 pm

Pindanin wrote:Hamstard will go through the portal and Jetstone will switch capitals trapping Hamstard. Hamstard with Wanda will decrypt all of the Jetstone dead and kill Tram. Ending thier side (no heir popping after all). Charlie will then kill Hamstard.
The former Jetstone plan was for Tram to fight and Slately to flee. With Slately staying Tram will need to flee for the same reasons he urged Slatly to flee: If all kings and heirs die, the side ends. The king is staying, so the heir must flee. So while Tram may die, it probably won't be for lack of running away.

If Parson dies the story is pretty much over. He is the Protagonist and main character, the story is all about what a Connecticut Yankee Gamer Geek in Overlord Stanley's Turn Based court would do. Parson is also the focus of three, well four separate conspiracies. So if anyone is death-proof, it's Parson, at least up until the conclusion of at least one of the conspiracies of which he is the focus. I wouldn't bother to follow the escapades of the Erfworlders as they continued to fight their endless wars. I'm not sure anyone would.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby querzis » Thu Oct 04, 2012 2:21 pm

Oberon wrote:
MonteCristo wrote:Before much of this went down, Tramennis was considering a ceasefire and setting up a non-aggression pact. And how did that end? Parson took advantage of the parley to turn the tide of battle against them. Quite frankly, Parson has proven himself poisonous to negotiate with in the mist of battle.
Hmmm, not quite. Tram refused to parley with the appointed GK negotiator and insisted on speaking to Parson himself. Then GK attacked. That's not to say things would have gone differently, but when you reject a spokesperson for no good reason it doesn't give much confidence to the other side that you plan to negotiate in good faith. Plus, wasn't the Jetstone plan to offer conditions GK would have had to refuse anyway? Wanda, and the pliers, plus a huge amount of schmuckers? All to let the dwagons fly out again? They thought they had their feet to the fire and were going to negotiate from that position of strength. Parson's 'treachery' let them understand just how mistaken they were. Tram quickly went from planning to demand more schmuckers for the damage to the garrison to trying to get Slately to fly away before the side fell.


First no not really, Tram intended to have some real negociations with him, its just him and his side who assumed it would be an offer they would have to refuse. But even if Parson had been right about that, it really woudnt change anything in the slightest. Parson attacked in the middle of a parley. It does not matter if they are in a position of strength or not, they are not gonna parley with him ever again and I really dont think any other side who ever heard about this will either. Its already been explained that, while its possible, attacking during parley is a big taboo in Erfworld...actually it is a big taboo in the real world too. Even dictators and frigging pirates almost never do that because they know that if you attack during the negociations even once, nobody will ever wanna negociate with you again. If Parson didnt wanna Parley with them, he just had to refuse the negociations, not use them as an opening. From now on, every future offer to parley Parson will ever attempt will be dismissed as another one of his tactics.

Thats Parson real problem really, he doesnt really seems to think about the long term too much instead focusing on the best way to win the battle he is fighting right now instead of how to win the war. He already alienated any future attempt to negociate with other sides and hes gonna alienate the entire Magic Kingdom. Except the Thinkamancer who need him and Mary friends, nobody there is ever gonna want to work with Parson again, hell they'll probably put a bounty on his head.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby Oberon » Thu Oct 04, 2012 3:12 pm

querzis wrote:First no not really, Tram intended to have some real negociations with him, its just him and his side who assumed it would be an offer they would have to refuse.
I read it differently. Yes, there was some chat between Tram and Slately about forming an alliance, but their plan for the negotiations was all about removing Wanda and the 'pliers, and getting a huge reparations payoff from GK. Oh, and then Tram threw a hissy fit and refused to parley with Ossomer and made unreasonable demands as to who he would speak with. Regardless of GKs plans, if Jetstone had come across as more sincere and less petulant and insulting, things may have gone very differently.
querzis wrote:Even dictators and frigging pirates almost never do that because they know that if you attack during the negociations even once, nobody will ever wanna negociate with you again.
You may want to read some history texts. Attacking during negotiations has been repeated again and again and again.
querzis wrote:If Parson didnt wanna Parley with them, he just had to refuse the negociations, not use them as an opening.
You're forgetting that it was Jetstone who refused to parley with the GK appointee, and insisted on speaking to someone else. That effectively ended the parley or negotiations.
querzis wrote:Thats Parson real problem really, he doesnt really seems to think about the long term too much instead focusing on the best way to win the battle he is fighting right now instead of how to win the war.
And you need to remember that right after the volcano Parson was replaced as CWL and was assisting with advice and calculations, but was in no way driving the war effort or strategies. He gave advice which helped the expeditionary forces be more successful, but until Ansom was captured and the (*ptui!*) Kingworld debacle occurred, Parson wasn't in charge. And once it did occur, the GK forces were doomed by every traditional calculation and by every character who remarked on what was going to happen next. Which was a part of the reason Jetstone wasn't going to treat with GK as equals: They knew, by their every estimation, that GK had to give huge concessions just to recover what they could. And you're calling it treachery for Parson to point out that they were terribly mistaken? No one in history would have done differently.

As an analogy, consider that you have an unarmed man at gunpoint, and you negotiate with him from this position of strength: "Give me all your money, your watch and jewelry, and I'll let you walk away with your life," you say.
After all, why offer better terms? You have all the cards! Your buddy Don King, watching through binoculars, he also thinks you have all the cards.
A shot rings out, pocking the pavement at your feet.
The man then says "I've got a friend with a sniper rifle, and the next shot will be between your eyes. So let's start over, shall we?"
Now you both have a clear understanding of the situation. You could still shoot the man, but it'll cost you your life as well. You're not going to get his wallet and his watch for nothing but letting him walk away, but perhaps some other solution can be agreed upon.
In case it's not clear: You are Jetstone, the man you have at gunpoint is GK.

That's what Parson did to Jetstone. That's not "treachery during negotiations", it's explaining that the situation as one side understands it needs to be strongly reconsidered and redefined. And it happens all the time, here on Stupidworld.

Oh, and to continue the analogy, in the situation I laid out for you how successful do you think a tactic such as "I won't discuss this with you any further. I insist on speaking with your sniper pal" would be?
*BANG*
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby No one in particular » Thu Oct 04, 2012 3:20 pm

querzis wrote:First no not really, Tram intended to have some real negociations with him, its just him and his side who assumed it would be an offer they would have to refuse. But even if Parson had been right about that, it really woudnt change anything in the slightest. Parson attacked in the middle of a parley. It does not matter if they are in a position of strength or not, they are not gonna parley with him ever again and I really dont think any other side who ever heard about this will either. Its already been explained that, while its possible, attacking during parley is a big taboo in Erfworld...actually it is a big taboo in the real world too. Even dictators and frigging pirates almost never do that because they know that if you attack during the negociations even once, nobody will ever wanna negociate with you again. If Parson didnt wanna Parley with them, he just had to refuse the negociations, not use them as an opening. From now on, every future offer to parley Parson will ever attempt will be dismissed as another one of his tactics.

Thats Parson real problem really, he doesnt really seems to think about the long term too much instead focusing on the best way to win the battle he is fighting right now instead of how to win the war. He already alienated any future attempt to negociate with other sides and hes gonna alienate the entire Magic Kingdom. Except the Thinkamancer who need him and Mary friends, nobody there is ever gonna want to work with Parson again, hell they'll probably put a bounty on his head.

In Parson's defense, from his point of view those bridges had already been burned. Everyone hated Gobwin Knob, the Royals hate Stanley the non-Royal, Jillian hates Stanley for destroying Faq, everyone's freaked out by Wanda's Decrypted, the Magic Kingdom already hates him (okay, they'll hate him more after this, but really, this should have been a dash instead of a marathon), Jetstone hates them for killing Ansom & Ossomer, Charlie hates him personally...

You'll notice, the only one who's been pushing for alliances has been Ansom and the Decrypted. Stanley doesn't care, Wanda doesn't care, Parson... did care, but was trying to distance himself from the war effort. They all saw that no one would listen to them.

As for seeing the long term, consider this: at the time of "negotiation," Wanda and the Pliers were in danger. There was absolutely NO WAY the RCC were going to let her go. If Parson lost the battle or even played along with the parley, he would have lost what had become the backbone of GK. Remember, the Decrypted aren't just in the army, they're everywhere. They man garrisons, (presumably) run farms, populate cities... if Wanda was lost, would she take the Decrypted with her? Would GK lose all the cities they'd reclaimed? Parson didn't know, but he DID know that GK would be crippled.

Like TBfGK, if there was going to BE a long run, Parson would have to win the short run.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby Lamech » Thu Oct 04, 2012 3:55 pm

The Pink Warlord wrote:Question:

Why don't Parson and Co head back to GK?

They're not losing anything they can't easily replace except for Sylvia and even she is far less important than their casters or even the good will of the Magic Kingdom.

Losing the Dwagons sucks but with parsons help Stanly can easily tame more. The Archons are already gone. Everything else is just standard troops and a few Warlords, both of which can easily be replaced.

Parson's poor emotional state. He's not making good moves. The archons should have had orders, they should have started hunting down the garrison earlier. The tower rubble should have been checked by now. They should have looted the king's body by now. Like Parson said, there is a difference between urgent and important. The units in Jetstone getting orders is urgent. Him being there is "important".

0beron wrote:Because it's a "too big to fail" commitment. If they totally abandon the fight, they have no dwagons and no army. Wanda needs the bodies from this fight to replenish the army and move on.
They are still extremely powerful. 8000ish talking units, and the ability to pop more dwagons is just plain nasty. Its probable a replacement could be gained for the veil detections of the archons as well. (Jack can probably make something to defeat foolamancy if a hatamancer can, or TGmTA can probably purchase something.) OTOH, Jillian has bugged out, TV is in no position to help, Jetstone will likely be in trouble with the loss of forces and a level 5 city, and Haggar is probably more likely to stab Jetstone in the face than help. Charlie could act against GK directly, but that removes his neutrality. Maybe Jillian could help, but she's at a serious city disadvantages when compared to GK.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby Chit Rule Railroad » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:59 pm

Earlier, I had been assuming that the casters would screen for Parson, but now that I think about it, Wanda is definitely more important to GK (for one thing, she can decrypt Parson but not vice-versa), and it's not a cut-and-dried call for the other casters either. Maggie is obviously important. While GK has some decrypted Gobwins, depriving them of Gobwins as an natural ally could be reducing their ability to mine gems without Sizemore. Also, we still don't know if decrypted casters can cast, but presumably a decrypted Parson would remain competent.

Moreover, we now have foreshadowing of the decrypted being capable of independent thought and free will, so it is conceivable that Erfworld could have a decrypted protagonist.

Crazy prediction: Jack goes in before Parson, but Wanda gets shuttled to Jetstone-city and single-handedly takes it. She has all her juice, in addition to decryption.


Some nitpicking...

Oberon wrote:I read it differently. Yes, there was some chat between Tram and Slately about forming an alliance, but their plan for the negotiations was all about removing Wanda and the 'pliers, and getting a huge reparations payoff from GK.

There was no talk of a reparations payoff, just a million Schmucker penalty clause to guarantee the non-aggression pact.

Lamech wrote:The archons should have had orders, they should have started hunting down the garrison earlier. The tower rubble should have been checked by now. They should have looted the king's body by now. Like Parson said, there is a difference between urgent and important. The units in Jetstone getting orders is urgent. Him being there is "important".

Maggie probably doesn't have enough juice to micromanage all that from GK, and it was not Parson's choice that Wanda would go through the portal into the MK without first encouraging her decrypted warlords to show initiative.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby spriteless » Thu Oct 04, 2012 5:03 pm

Is it just me, or does Tramenis look like Strawberry Shortcake?
T'was a splendidly speedy defection.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby querzis » Thu Oct 04, 2012 5:14 pm

Oberon wrote:
querzis wrote:Even dictators and frigging pirates almost never do that because they know that if you attack during the negociations even once, nobody will ever wanna negociate with you again.
You may want to read some history texts. Attacking during negotiations has been repeated again and again and again.


Yeah no, not at all. Nevermind the fact that right now, attacking during negociations is a war crime in any events everywhere in the world, the most famous example of someone being attacked during negociations was Genghis Khan and his mongol horde of all people. He was negociating with the Khwarezmid Empire and then the empire decided to attack a mongol caravan and its envoy and send back the mongol ambassador head to Genghis Khan. Whats that? Never heard of the Khwarezmid empire? Well considering how Genghis Khan utterly destroyed the empire, killing all its citizens thats hardly surprising. Genghis Khan, the infamous Genghis Khan, considered ambassadors to be «sacred and untouchable» and the real kicker is that none of the allies of the empire and not even what remained of the Jin dinasty tried to help the Empire since they considered Genghis Khan to be perfectly justified. Yeah really, the chinese which Genghis Khan had been fighting for decades at that point considered Genghis Khan to be fully in his right to destroy the Empire.

Its not just that attacking during negociations is a big deal in the real world, its that, if attacking during negociations is as big a deal in medieval looking Erfworld as it was back in our medievial time, pretty much everything Charlie and jetstone do from now on will be considered justified and honorable as far as the other sides goes. Aint that great?

Oberon wrote:
querzis wrote:If Parson didnt wanna Parley with them, he just had to refuse the negociations, not use them as an opening.
You're forgetting that it was Jetstone who refused to parley with the GK appointee, and insisted on speaking to someone else. That effectively ended the parley or negotiations.


...they did not refuse Ossomer, they were still talking to him when Parson started the attack. Sure they asked to talk to Parson but thats not refusing to Parley under absolutely any convention. You are looking at this purely in gaming term (and so is Parson for the most part, despite finally regarding units as humans). Sure individuals betray their words all the time and attack after faking to be peaceful but not governments! Not now, still a war crime, not before, was even worse then a war crime, it wasnt ever «not a big deal». I'm a bloody historian (or at least I got a diploma in it...cant deny I havent been able to get a job) so yeah governments dont attack during negociations, if you dont believe me start looking for government or countries who did.

Oberon wrote:
querzis wrote:Thats Parson real problem really, he doesnt really seems to think about the long term too much instead focusing on the best way to win the battle he is fighting right now instead of how to win the war.
And you need to remember that right after the volcano Parson was replaced as CWL and was assisting with advice and calculations, but was in no way driving the war effort or strategies. He gave advice which helped the expeditionary forces be more successful, but until Ansom was captured and the (*ptui!*) Kingworld debacle occurred, Parson wasn't in charge. And once it did occur, the GK forces were doomed by every traditional calculation and by every character who remarked on what was going to happen next. Which was a part of the reason Jetstone wasn't going to treat with GK as equals: They knew, by their every estimation, that GK had to give huge concessions just to recover what they could. And you're calling it treachery for Parson to point out that they were terribly mistaken? No one in history would have done differently.


As I pointed out, yes, most rulers in history would have done differently. Attacking during negociations would have been suicide for most of our history, even if you win the battle, all your allies are gonna leave you and you,re gonna get tons of new enemies. Now, unlike your point, I do kinda agree with «no one in particular» point that Parson probably already think most sides are his enemies and they dont actually have any allies right now anyway but it doesnt change the fact nobody from other sides is gonna trust him in the future and nothing in the rest of your post change that so I'm not even gonna bother replying to all of it. Individuals can do that, not frigging governments (not that your analogy work since, once again, no Tram most definitly wasnt planning to screw them out with his deal, GK would still have been a very strong side without Wanda...hell, considering the fact that one of the main reason there is this big Alliance against them right now is mostly because of Wanda and her decrypted, its not like they coudnt make peace with everyone except Jillian and Charlie if shes gone.)
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby arin » Thu Oct 04, 2012 5:17 pm

To me, the unspoken part of the plan seems obvious - Slately is going to burn Spacerock to the ground as soon as he's sure Parson has entered the city.

That's why the unborn heir is being aborted, because the city itself won't be standing or Jetstone-controlled at the end of the turn. It's kinda poetic justice, when you think about it - Parson did a "rocks fall, everybody dies" move back in GK, and now Charlie is, through Slately, getting the chance to do precisely the same thing.

Sylvia's conversation about their being able to leave the garrison only after all Jetstone units are croaked is, from this perspective, an obvious foreshadowing of the fight to come - Parson will have to find a way to eliminate JS before burning to death in a flaming garrison.

This is gonna be cool. :)
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby effataigus » Thu Oct 04, 2012 6:50 pm

Eh, get with the times. Getting offended about parley violation is so Book 1. The parley violation in book 2 wasn't even a violation since the parley in no way helped GK get the attack off. Ossomer didn't even pee on the zone boundary like he would have if he was more of a bro.

Mouthing off about attacking through the magic kingdom is the new hip thing. In Trams words, it's "unconscionable"... which coming from a Jetstonian is just a big word for rad.
...
With that out of my system...

Huh, I had been forgetting about Wanda's juice. We don't know what all she can do with it besides uncroak, but I gotta wonder if the dead can be uncroaked before they are decrypted. Leeroy sure seemed to leave a body behind. Wanda should recycle more IMO.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby wrecan » Thu Oct 04, 2012 6:55 pm

Fortunately, he'll have a dirtamancer to locate the buried-alive Cubbins...
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby bladestorm » Thu Oct 04, 2012 6:57 pm

effataigus wrote:Eh, get with the times. Getting offended about parley violation is so Book 1. The parley violation in book 2 wasn't even a violation since the parley in no way helped GK get the attack off. Ossomer didn't even pee on the zone boundary like he would have if he was more of a bro.

Mouthing off about attacking through the magic kingdom is the new hip thing. In Trams words, it's "unconscionable"... which coming from a Jetstonian is just a big word for rad.
...
With that out of my system...

Huh, I had been forgetting about Wanda's juice. We don't know what all she can do with it besides uncroak, but I gotta wonder if the dead can be uncroaked before they are decrypted. Leeroy sure seemed to leave a body behind. Wanda should recycle more IMO.

If they are uncroaked before decrypted, do they retain their living stats, or their uncroaked stats? Would be kinda weak if all you did was a second reanimation, and they still had negligible mental capacity.

OTOH, this could be an excellent opportunity to find out what Croakamancy can do other than uncroak. Or if Wanda has some offensive capabilities from other disciplines.

On another side note, do decrypted yellow dwagons still crap? Get a stack of those, and have them fuel Sizemore's crap golem army. Ready in minutes.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby Lamech » Thu Oct 04, 2012 7:28 pm

effataigus wrote:Eh, get with the times. Getting offended about parley violation is so Book 1. The parley violation in book 2 wasn't even a violation since the parley in no way helped GK get the attack off. Ossomer didn't even pee on the zone boundary like he would have if he was more of a bro.
Yeah, its really rich for Jetstone to be getting mad about parley violations after what Jillian pulled. Twice.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby Kyrt » Thu Oct 04, 2012 7:53 pm

Lamech wrote:Parson's poor emotional state. He's not making good moves. The archons should have had orders, they should have started hunting down the garrison earlier. The tower rubble should have been checked by now. They should have looted the king's body by now. Like Parson said, there is a difference between urgent and important. The units in Jetstone getting orders is urgent. Him being there is "important".


Him being there is urgent. Toppling the tower wasn't, after all, part of his plan. Thus issuing orders to (for example) search the rubble wouldn't be doing much good - even if he could give them. There wasn't supposed to be rubble to search.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby Lamech » Thu Oct 04, 2012 8:08 pm

Kyrt wrote:
Lamech wrote:Parson's poor emotional state. He's not making good moves. The archons should have had orders, they should have started hunting down the garrison earlier. The tower rubble should have been checked by now. They should have looted the king's body by now. Like Parson said, there is a difference between urgent and important. The units in Jetstone getting orders is urgent. Him being there is "important".


Him being there is urgent. Toppling the tower wasn't, after all, part of his plan. Thus issuing orders to (for example) search the rubble wouldn't be doing much good - even if he could give them. There wasn't supposed to be rubble to search.
He should have be paying attention. Or he should have given someone the position to give commands in the field in case something goes screwy. Instead he let the chain of command disintegrate. Which meant those Archons died without even trying to fight back. It means that the kings body isn't looted. You shouldn't have a bunch of units standing around, with no one in charge if they get attacked. Which is what Parson did.

Also there was no reason not to topple the tower. If the tower fall what would be the blow back? They win?
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby 0beron » Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:35 pm

Lamech wrote:He should have be paying attention.
And...how is he supposed to pay attention? Maggie is out of juice, he has no way to know what's happening in Spacerock.
Or he should have given someone the position to give commands in the field in case something goes screwy.
He has, they're called WARLORDS, like Sylvia.
Instead he let the chain of command disintegrate.
See earlier point about Maggie. She is the chain of command, and her battery's dead.
Also there was no reason not to topple the tower. If the tower fall what would be the blow back? They win?
If the Tower had fallen with Slately still in it, Jetstone would have ended, thus closing the portal and preventing Parson from going through. Sure GK would win the battle then, but there is still the GK column waiting on the road as sitting ducks, with Hagar (and possibly Charlie) still nearby as a threat. So even if they win the battle of Spacerock, they still "need" Parson there to make sure they keep it.
"I'm afraid I don't understand. And also afraid that I do."
GJC wrote:Two guys with basically the same name in a discussion about a character getting cloned.
There's gotta be a good joke in here somewhere.
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Re: Book 2 – Page 91

Postby No one in particular » Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:48 pm

Lamech wrote:He should have be paying attention.
Paying attention to WHAT? From Parson's point of view, he gave the command to "Food Fight" to Wanda, then immediately headed to the Portal where he expected to make a 30 second dash to Jetstone's portal, where he would be able to direct things on the scene, as well as provide the Chief Warlord bonus.
Lamech wrote:Or he should have given someone the position to give commands in the field in case something goes screwy.
You mean like all the Warlord and Caster units can? All the Warlord and Caster units that are already there? And made things screwy by trying to use their own initiative?
Lamech wrote:Instead he let the chain of command disintegrate.
No, MAGGIE disintegrated the chain of command when she "suggested" that Stanley make Parson Chief Warlord again.
Lamech wrote:Which meant those Archons died without even trying to fight back.
What are you talking about? Why wouldn't they fight back? And what makes you think they didn't? They started getting into attack formation back in LIAB 75, prioritized and targeted Slately on 77, croaked Ossomer on 78, croaked Slately on 79... the fact that they weren't buffed as well as Jetstone and that their Foolamancy wasn't working doesn't mean they didn't fight!
Lamech wrote:You shouldn't have a bunch of units standing around, with no one in charge if they get attacked. Which is what Parson did.
Again, all of GKs Warlords are already on the scene. Wanda and Jack were too, and Parson didn't tell them to come to the MK.
Lamech wrote:Also there was no reason not to topple the tower. If the tower fall what would be the blow back? They win?
Parson told Wanda and Jack that his plan was to come through the portal (see LIAB 68). The blowback is spelled out on LIAB 70. Specifically, panel 11 and panel 12. Here, I'll even spell it out for you again:
LIAB 70 wrote:Jack: But supposing you don't care to stack with that… conceptual crap golem your mistress has constructed, consider this: Cause: If we took the city now, it would no longer be a capital. This portal would close. Effect: Our Chief Warlord would be trapped in the Magic Kingdom.
Antium: Yes, but that will happen at any moment anyway. As soon as the tower falls.
"Are you always so pessimistic?"
"Not at all. I saved it for my last battle."
---
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