Summer Update - 026

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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby Spot » Fri Aug 28, 2009 2:50 am

OneHugeTuck wrote:If I win the 325Million lotto tomorrow night (and I will) I'm going to be a Medici-style patron.



You're going to poison people?

;)
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby Lestat » Fri Aug 28, 2009 3:19 am

I wonder if a garrison unit can decide to leave the city on its' own without any orders. Stanley said Parson would have to be 'promoted' from garrison unit to see if he even has move. If he can leave without asking the Tool, than I strongly suspect he can also leave a hex on someone elses turn or even at night. After all, while healing and cleansing apply to Parson like any other Erfworlder, he seems to be the only one that gets tired walking around, so maybe his locomotion follows more real world rules: he doesn't have move limit, but he gets exhusted walking long distances.

If Parson can traverse hexes without limitation, I imagine he could use a sort of pony express system to move around on someone elses' turn. Like, an enemy is moving towards a hex he has some unlead troops in. As long as he is closer and has mounts in all hexes between him and his goal, he could just dismount in one hex, go through the border and get on a different mount on the other hex. This strategy could be far more usefull if Parson had higher leadership, but it would certainly be an interesting exploit for him.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby dholm » Fri Aug 28, 2009 5:09 am

SteveMB wrote:
Graydon wrote:
Ambug666 wrote:Didn't Parson leave the city when he went to the magic realm?

The mechanism was a magic portal; presumably, this does not involve Move.

It almost can't involve Move


No "almost" about it -- we saw a one-shot (i.e. from some other side) caster use a portal during Gobwin Knob's turn.


You're assuming only Gobwin Knob could have their turn at that particular time. That isn't true -- we know that all Sides' turns start at dawn unless they are in Battlespace.

I agree that it doesn't take Move, though.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby kunsttyv » Fri Aug 28, 2009 6:32 am

dholm wrote:
SteveMB wrote:
Graydon wrote:The mechanism was a magic portal; presumably, this does not involve Move.

It almost can't involve Move


No "almost" about it -- we saw a one-shot (i.e. from some other side) caster use a portal during Gobwin Knob's turn.


You're assuming only Gobwin Knob could have their turn at that particular time. That isn't true -- we know that all Sides' turns start at dawn unless they are in Battlespace.


You are mistaken. We don't know that. It might be this way, but also it might not. You assume that dawn is the same for everyone.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby Welf von Ehrwald » Fri Aug 28, 2009 6:46 am

dholm wrote:
SteveMB wrote:You're assuming only Gobwin Knob could have their turn at that particular time. That isn't true -- we know that all Sides' turns start at dawn unless they are in Battlespace.

I agree that it doesn't take Move, though.


By the way, we have prov, that you don't need move. When Parson and the linked casters used the portal the first time, it wasn't their turn, but the RCCs'. And when they returned, it was before dawn and before their turn started.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby raphfrk » Fri Aug 28, 2009 7:57 am

Graydon wrote:Since we don't know if Parson not showing stats is because all or most of Parson's stats are invisible, or if all or most of Parson's stats don't exist, Parson being able to leave the city won't really tell us anything about Parson's status in Erf. Parson not being able to leave the city will tell us a great deal, though; that will strongly imply that everything Parson lacks a stat for he cannot do.


If he can leave the city, he can still test if he has move by moving over and back across the hex boundary. However, if he has an odd number of moves, then he would be trapped outside the city for the night.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby warriortribble » Fri Aug 28, 2009 8:25 am

Spot wrote:You're going to poison people?

;)
I thought only one member of that family did that.

I seem to be a bit lost here. Parson wants to know if he can leave the city, but why should he question that?
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby Welf von Ehrwald » Fri Aug 28, 2009 8:49 am

raphfrk wrote:If he can leave the city, he can still test if he has move by moving over and back across the hex boundary. However, if he has an odd number of moves, then he would be trapped outside the city for the night.


Not necessarily; he can order a dwagon to fly him back. Or 4 archons with a net.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby SteveMB » Fri Aug 28, 2009 9:24 am

warriortribble wrote:Parson wants to know if he can leave the city, but why should he question that?

Stanley seems to think that he's a Garrison unit (which would imply zero Move). If he has zero Move, and is bound by Erfworld mechanics, he shouldn't be able to leave the city. He's trying the experiment.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby fehler » Fri Aug 28, 2009 9:43 am

Lestat wrote:If Parson can traverse hexes without limitation, I imagine he could use a sort of pony express system to move around on someone elses' turn. Like, an enemy is moving towards a hex he has some unlead troops in. As long as he is closer and has mounts in all hexes between him and his goal, he could just dismount in one hex, go through the border and get on a different mount on the other hex.


This was already shown to be the case with the Dwagon Dwonut of Dwoom, with Manpower, Singh and Leeroy cycling fresh mounts. Mounts use they're own move, which is why Parson is testing this on foot rather than Dwagonback.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby MarbitChow » Fri Aug 28, 2009 10:09 am

fehler wrote:
Lestat wrote:If Parson can traverse hexes without limitation, I imagine he could use a sort of pony express system to move around on someone elses' turn. Like, an enemy is moving towards a hex he has some unlead troops in. As long as he is closer and has mounts in all hexes between him and his goal, he could just dismount in one hex, go through the border and get on a different mount on the other hex.


This was already shown to be the case with the Dwagon Dwonut of Dwoom, with Manpower, Singh and Leeroy cycling fresh mounts. Mounts use they're own move, which is why Parson is testing this on foot rather than Dwagonback.


Actually, what has been shown is that the rider can use the mount's move.

What Lestat is talking about is to allow Parson to move, using mounts to traverse each hex, from one hex border to the other side, so that he doesn't tire out.
The mounts can't leave the hex because it's not their turn.
If Parson can cross the hex boundaries, and his only limit is that he gets tired, the mounts can keep Parson fresh as long as there is a mount in each hex that he wants to pass through.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby nerf-dweller » Fri Aug 28, 2009 10:48 am

gameboy1234 wrote:Yeah, good update, and lots of good info. I hadn't thought that Parson was truly concerned that he can't move outside the city, but I guess he is. It'll be interesting to see what the result of their little experiment is.

I'm also really curious where book 2 is going to start. I think Jillian and Transylvito are settled, but GK still is up in the air for me. I still favor a revolt against Stanley, though that may be in no one's (esp. Wanda's) best interest right now.

Oh yes: Sizemore + Maggie <3 4 ever


I think that Paron's presence and now his resisting Erfworld's framework is going to make some fundamental (world breaking) changes to the world. In regards to Sizemore and Maggie and Erfworld, I'm seeing a parallel to an episode from the Original Star Trek service, a tribe of humanoids in service to a world machine called Val. When replacements are needed if a villager died, they just showed up. I'm seeing Erfworld itself in the role of Val, and Parrson in the role of Captain Kirk and crew. I think it may be a budding romance in regards to Sizemore and Maggie. When Parson finally explains how humans "pop" a new units, I think Sizemore and Maggie might explore the human method to "pop" a unit.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby nerf-dweller » Fri Aug 28, 2009 11:02 am

Lestat wrote:If Parson can traverse hexes without limitation, I imagine he could use a sort of pony express system to move around on someone elses' turn. Like, an enemy is moving towards a hex he has some unlead troops in. As long as he is closer and has mounts in all hexes between him and his goal, he could just dismount in one hex, go through the border and get on a different mount on the other hex. This strategy could be far more usefull if Parson had higher leadership, but it would certainly be an interesting exploit for him.


And one has to wonder if any "unit" in Erfworld have ever tried to work beyond their stats? Have any unit/individual tried to travel their MOVE + 1? They pop into the Erfworld with all of their knowledge innate. They just "know" how the world works. So more would just accept that's the way things world without really experimenting to see if that's true.

Parson's picnic might be the first experiment of that type in Erfworld. Can Paron move around hex boundaries at the end of his sides turn? Can he move at night? Could Sizemore and Maggie possibly do the same things if Parson prods them to actually try it? IF units can actually move at night out of turn, and having an army of Decrypted troops that require no upkeep, and Parson to game the rules of Erfworld.... Talk about an ultimate weapon.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby DevilDan » Fri Aug 28, 2009 11:18 am

nerf-dweller wrote:And one has to wonder if any "unit" in Erfworld have ever tried to work beyond their stats? Have any unit/individual tried to travel their MOVE + 1? They pop into the Erfworld with all of their knowledge innate. They just "know" how the world works. So more would just accept that's the way things world without really experimenting to see if that's true.


We do know that units cannot move outside of turn: we saw Jill smash into a hex wall while chasing Stanley at the end of the battle of the Faq pass.

Didn't Misty also say that a unit's move drops to zero at night? Some sort of feedback mechanism or HUD must tell them all this.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby HandofShadows » Fri Aug 28, 2009 11:24 am

DevilDan wrote:Didn't Misty also say that a unit's move drops to zero at night? Some sort of feedback mechanism or HUD must tell them all this.


Commanders can see units stats and castors can be commanders. So they should be able to see if a units stats change. Also Maggie knew that Bagroll leveled twice without even seeing him.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby DevilDan » Fri Aug 28, 2009 12:43 pm

HandofShadows wrote:
DevilDan wrote:Didn't Misty also say that a unit's move drops to zero at night? Some sort of feedback mechanism or HUD must tell them all this.


Commanders can see units stats and castors can be commanders. So they should be able to see if a units stats change. Also Maggie knew that Bagroll leveled twice without even seeing him.

I'm specifically concerned in this case about what tells a unit how much move he has left, not what others can tell.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby OneHugeTuck » Fri Aug 28, 2009 12:51 pm

Spot wrote:
OneHugeTuck wrote:If I win the 325Million lotto tomorrow night (and I will) I'm going to be a Medici-style patron.



You're going to poison people?

;)


If you don't do what I want you to do. Absolutely.

Go buy a lotto ticket, so you can hire a ninja defense team.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby DevilDan » Fri Aug 28, 2009 1:15 pm

Headmaster: Name two ways of defending yourself from Italian Renaissance-style assassination by poisoning, Watson.
Watson: Hire a ninja defense team, sir.
Headmaster: What's wrong with a cupbearer, boy? Hm? Why not start off with a nice cupbearer? You don't have to go leaping straight for the ninja defense team like a bull at a gate. Hire a cupbearer, boy.


With apologies to everyone. Seriously. Just to everyone.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby dholm » Fri Aug 28, 2009 2:29 pm

kunsttyv wrote:
dholm wrote:You're assuming only Gobwin Knob could have their turn at that particular time. That isn't true -- we know that all Sides' turns start at dawn unless they are in Battlespace.


You are mistaken. We don't know that. It might be this way, but also it might not. You assume that dawn is the same for everyone.


Perhaps not everyone's turn starts at dawn, but it is certain that multiple sides can have turns at the same time, as long as they are not in Battlespace with one another.
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Re: Summer Update - 026

Postby kunsttyv » Fri Aug 28, 2009 2:38 pm

dholm wrote:
kunsttyv wrote:
dholm wrote:You're assuming only Gobwin Knob could have their turn at that particular time. That isn't true -- we know that all Sides' turns start at dawn unless they are in Battlespace.


You are mistaken. We don't know that. It might be this way, but also it might not. You assume that dawn is the same for everyone.


Perhaps not everyone's turn starts at dawn, but it is certain that multiple sides can have turns at the same time, as long as they are not in Battlespace with one another.


Is this certain? Can you show me an example of this? (bear in mind that it is stated that captives share turn with their captors, and allies all use the turn of the "last" member)
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