Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby wrecan » Sat Feb 09, 2013 7:14 pm

I have a feeling the Tin Man's whistle was Jack's doing. He caused a distraction that let him switch out the Axe before OIive had a chance to cast.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby Berserkas » Sat Feb 09, 2013 7:22 pm

"you have my acts", heh heh heh. And his acts beat Olive's.

Image

Really, there's still a lot Olive can do. She must have full juice, Jillian is the only really combat-capable person in the room (except perhaps Wanda), and Olive can use Flower Power on a single person, just like the Grand Abbie (forgot her name) disabled Jojo for a full turn. Not to mention she is level 12, and she might just be capable of casting that mass spell without even the Chillaxe.

And yes, Banhammer may yet order Jillian to stand down, but she'd probably ignore that, thinking that she's acting for the best interests of the side... which is a condition for ignoring orders.

So, whatever happens next, should be pretty interesting. I mean, we know Jillian wins (she's fated to) but there's still enough the enemy can do to keep up the suspense.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby Whispri » Sat Feb 09, 2013 7:23 pm

There's nothing to stop Olive from using the same sort of Flower Power on Gillian that Janis used on Jeftichew ... but I'd say destroying the Chilaxe should count as killing her, if it leaves her vulnerable to, for example, Wanda.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby wrecan » Sat Feb 09, 2013 7:43 pm

Well, due toPredictamancy, Olive knows that pacifying Jillian at least prevents herfrom getting croaked sinceshe knows Jillian is fated to croak the Ruler of Faq.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby tgriff02 » Sat Feb 09, 2013 7:58 pm

Whispri wrote:There's nothing to stop Olive from using the same sort of Flower Power on Gillian that Janis used on Jeftichew ... but I'd say destroying the Chilaxe should count as killing her, if it leaves her vulnerable to, for example, Wanda.


This is VERY true, and there's probably plenty of other things that she can do as well. Aside from her affinity for plant type units, Janis's Flower Power, and the poisoning of Tommy, do we really know exactly what a Hippiemancer can do? There must be more, or else they would be virtually useless units in Erf, even as powerful as the non-engagement spell potentially is, it was presented in a manor which implied the mancer needs to be in the feild for that one. Since the general rule of tactics is that Mancers do not belong in the field, I would say they must have some other tactical potential. And the fact that Olive is lvl 12 is not to be taken lightly, either. Wanda, circa TBFGK, is kick ass-bad ass, and not lvl 12. For all we know, Olive could fart them to death if she can think of the right application of her skills on the fly.

*edited for gross grammar abuse
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby Jamus » Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:16 pm

I'd like to share a sudden epileptic tree.

It starts with the fact that Charlie at least knows all about Judy and what she is and where she came from. It seems obvious that he used the shoes as inspiration for the spell he gave Jojo, to take Parson home. And that it likely does what it says on the tin.

But given that he has knowledge of interdimensional transportation, and knows that stupidworld is a place, it made me suddenly wonder- did Charlie ALSO have a hand in bringing Parson into Erfworld? If it weren't that we were told at least part of Parson's purpose in Erf is to defeat Charlie, then Charlie would be a prime suspect.

And then there's Olive. Olive, who wages war with peace, and discovers that peace magic isn't actually enough to bring peace to Erfworld. Olive, who is both Overlady AND Caster. Whose side just fell apart along with everything she worked for. Who is in a city that is about to fall (probably with her head) but also, incidentally, in the garrison. So she darts into the MK. Lets her side fall to FAQ behind her. She becomes a barbarian. She can't ever leave the MK until Jillian is dead, because Jillian will kill her. So she doesn't.

And the signamancy of this stagnation makes her fat. And she takes a name. She lost her Chillaxe, but she was a musician at some point. She takes the name Janis, not even knowing the stupidworld reference. She knows Charlie. She knows Wanda, who casts the spell. She knows Marie. Janis wants to break Erfworld because she can't bring peace to it any other way. Janis IS Olive.

It would even explain part of Janis's semi-terror, as I recall, of going through the portal.

The only thing I can think of that doesn't fit is how Wanda and Janis get along in the MK all this time since. But then, I'm not sure we've ever seen them together, expect very, very briefly in the last MK update or two.

As for Charlie's part in the SPW spell.. it strikes me as interesting that the parties from or aware of stupidworld all bump up against the diminishing returns inherent in Erfworld. You can't make a side too big before you can't support it anymore, and supporting a side REQUIRES war. Judy and Olive try a tactic of peace magic and nearly empty cities. Charlie consolidates to one city, one side, one unit type, not even expensive warlords, and using magic from the MK to bend the rules as much as he can.

I'm not sure that Charlie is necessarily unhappy with the way this all goes- he's winning- but he might be bored. He might very much have wanted someone on his level. ESPECIALLY if he's from Stupidworld. He may even have been planning to USE the SPW after he manipulated people into crafting it for him, but had it used by GK at the last moment. Which would explain why he so desperately wants Parson, now.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby Glome » Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:28 pm

tgriff02 wrote:
Whispri wrote:There's nothing to stop Olive from using the same sort of Flower Power on Gillian that Janis used on Jeftichew ... but I'd say destroying the Chilaxe should count as killing her, if it leaves her vulnerable to, for example, Wanda.


This is VERY true, and there's probably plenty of other things that she can do as well. Aside from her affinity for plant type units, Janis's Flower Power, and the poisoning of Tommy, do we really know exactly what a Hippiemancer can do? There must be more, or else they would be virtually useless units in Erf, even as powerful as the non-engagement spell potentially is, it was presented in a manor which implied the mancer needs to be in the feild for that one. Since the general rule of tactics is that Mancers do not belong in the field, I would say they must have some other tactical potential.


There are quite a few 'mancers that only shine in the field or close to it, Croakamancers, foolamancers, healomancers, and dittomancers to name a few. With that said, florists can do a lot even when not in the field. Olive didn't need to be in the field to poison Jillian's raiding party, or create those tannenbaums. So while there may be more a florist can do, I just don't see them as being in any way weak based on what we know about them.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby nargbop » Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:29 pm

There's a small number of Faq units here, but Olive probably has the means to quell all straightforward attacks with her Hippiemancy.
She can't avoid friendly touches, and Wanda will probably have a Croakamancy equivalent to her poisoned kiss.
Or, more fittingly, fill a bin with all the remaining heroine buds and toss 'er on in.
As much as I want Olive to croak, she might still be alive in the main timeline. Janis is "a" Grand Abbey, not "the" Grand Abbey.

Edit : Ninja's on the "Olive is Janis" idea. Someone may have been also mentioned it many forum posts ago.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby Glome » Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:36 pm

nargbop wrote:.
As much as I want Olive to croak, she might still be alive in the main timeline. Janis is "a" Grand Abbey, not "the" Grand Abbey.

Edit : Ninja's on the "Olive is Janis" idea. Someone may have been also mentioned it many forum posts ago.


That doesn't leave much room for Jillian to croak the ruler of Haffaton then. What is Olive going to do, make Orwell heir with non-existent money and abdicate, and then Jillian is going to kill Orwell?
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby tgriff02 » Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:43 pm

Glome wrote:
tgriff02 wrote:
Whispri wrote:There's nothing to stop Olive from using the same sort of Flower Power on Gillian that Janis used on Jeftichew ... but I'd say destroying the Chilaxe should count as killing her, if it leaves her vulnerable to, for example, Wanda.


This is VERY true, and there's probably plenty of other things that she can do as well. Aside from her affinity for plant type units, Janis's Flower Power, and the poisoning of Tommy, do we really know exactly what a Hippiemancer can do? There must be more, or else they would be virtually useless units in Erf, even as powerful as the non-engagement spell potentially is, it was presented in a manor which implied the mancer needs to be in the feild for that one. Since the general rule of tactics is that Mancers do not belong in the field, I would say they must have some other tactical potential.


There are quite a few 'mancers that only shine in the field or close to it, Croakamancers, foolamancers, healomancers, and dittomancers to name a few. With that said, florists can do a lot even when not in the field. Olive didn't need to be in the field to poison Jillian's raiding party, or create those tannenbaums. So while there may be more a florist can do, I just don't see them as being in any way weak based on what we know about them.


I didn't mean to imply that they were weak, just that general tactical convention has been shown to be that you try to keep your mancers off the field, they are too expensive and upridictable to replace. That ALL seem to have incredible combat applications, but then one of the recurring themes of the comic has been how poorly underused casters are in Erf. Jack was used for veiling cities, and while that seems to have be an unconventional application, at nopoint is the theory put forth that foolamancer's NORMALLY see combat. All the mancies that we've really seen, we've really seen how they can be used by an Overlord to manipulate the sides production or governing to maximize effeciency of combat units. If the best Oliv has for non combat ability is to produce units, and improve farm production, then she's not any better than a dollamancer or dirtamancer in that regard, but botho f those schools have other applications. So I was INTENDING to infer that there SHOULD be other things that Olive can dow ith her school, that we haven't seen yet.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby cheeseaholic » Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:52 pm

The *smart* thing to do would to spare her life and the capital in exchange for surrendering all of her other cities and nondisclosure. Then hiring Charlie to croak her or something. They could raze everything not Faq and have one hell of a treasury.

Of course Jillian won't think of this and the king won't do it. Oh well, I hope they go on a razing binge on the trip home at least.



Judy must have really impressed Wanda in the past if she thought of searching through worlds for a warlord was the best thing to do with 500k.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby Manic Oppressive » Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:53 pm

Manic Oppressive wrote:And as a Kansas resident, allow me to state my opinion on all of these horrible, base, vile and disgusting accusations of the nature of Kansas.

They are completely true. Carry on.

Yes you stand up for Kansas. Good on you. Can you fix the education system whilst you're at it?[/quote]

Did you read what I posted? I am not standing up for this wretched, terrible state.
Why yes, I do like Jillian. WHAT OF IT?
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby bladestorm » Sat Feb 09, 2013 9:16 pm

Do we have the actual wording of the Prediction that Jillian will croak the ruler of Haffaton, or was that an implication that was reworded by a character?
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby kefkakrazy » Sat Feb 09, 2013 9:21 pm

Swiftbow wrote:
Knight13 wrote:
On another note... it just occurred to me that Olive is Glinda, the "good" witch of the north.



I've read a piece before, fairly well-written, that made a decently convincing argument that Glinda (at least the movie version) was every bit as self-serving and nasty as the Wicked witches.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby MonteCristo » Sat Feb 09, 2013 10:18 pm

Y'know, just by finding those shoes, wanda may have fulfilled her role as a poison pill... everything is collapsing in front of Olive
Though I wonder if Wanda is not done just yet. Frankly i would love to see Olive end with a goodbye kiss... though from we know, if anyone it will be Jillian who will be the one to end her.

bladestorm wrote:Do we have the actual wording of the Prediction that Jillian will croak the ruler of Haffaton, or was that an implication that was reworded by a character?


No, we can't be certain of what the exact wording of it since the prediction was made by a caster who croaked a long time ago. What we have is a second hand account by Wanda who said that... oh Olive, she's now staring fate in the face and its carrying a huge sword with her name written on it


Glome wrote:
nargbop wrote:.
As much as I want Olive to croak, she might still be alive in the main timeline. Janis is "a" Grand Abbey, not "the" Grand Abbey.

Edit : Ninja's on the "Olive is Janis" idea. Someone may have been also mentioned it many forum posts ago.


That doesn't leave much room for Jillian to croak the ruler of Haffaton then. What is Olive going to do, make Orwell heir with non-existent money and abdicate, and then Jillian is going to kill Orwell?


Well she could do that... granted, i doubt haffaton would have the smuckers to promote Orwell; but on the otherhand if Olive is gonna abandon Haffaton she could get the smuckers by razing the cities.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby teratorn » Sat Feb 09, 2013 10:33 pm

Kaed wrote:Shame about the Arkenshoes... infinite move. Hmmm hmm. That might explain how Olive was able to reach Jillian regardless of her scooting around on Crapsack.


She'd need to be attuned to them.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby ManaCaster » Sat Feb 09, 2013 10:49 pm

I take it this means Jack can simulate touch? I wonder how far that extends?

If I were Olive Branch, I'd probably try to raze a bunch of cities, promote Orwell to heir designate, give him orders to distract Jillian, abdicate (making the prophecy his problem), and flee for the magical kingdom, all as quickly as possible. It would be a long shot, but worth a try.

Speaking of poor Orwell, I wonder how he is going to croak? Faq had no early warning of Stanley's attack, so it is clear that he won't survive this. But croaking Olive would just leave him "neutral" since he's in a city, so something else is probably going to happen to him.
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby warriortribble » Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:25 pm

So at least one Arkentool existed in Stupidworld before the main story began and they're there right now. What does this mean I wonder? What is the link between our mundane world and the bizzaro turn based one?
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby Mogster2 » Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:34 pm

ManaCaster wrote:Speaking of poor Orwell, I wonder how he is going to croak? Faq had no early warning of Stanley's attack, so it is clear that he won't survive this. But croaking Olive would just leave him "neutral" since he's in a city, so something else is probably going to happen to him.

It's my understanding that if a ruler dies without an heir, the entire side is automatically disbanded. That's what happened to Uniroyal - the queen emptied the treasury as much as possible before disbanding herself to leave Stanley as little as possible and no units for Wanda to uncroak. If Orwell entered the magic kingdom beforehand then he might survive Haffaton's destruction, but he can't become a barbarian. But maybe I missed something and casters aren't bound by the same rules.

Incidentally I don't know if this was mentioned before, but there's another clue that Charlie is from Stupidworld: at the end of Page 89 where Charlie says "We kill the fat man." No one from Erfworld is known to have used the word "kill."
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Re: Inner Peace (Through Superior Firepower) – Episode 062

Postby Ambug666 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 12:04 am

So it all happened before. At least one Hippiemnancer tried to bring someone from Stupidword over to stop the war. It didn't work then. Will it all get booped up again? This makes Parson's references to the Wizard of Oz all the more interesting. I wonder how long Judy has been in Erfword based on stupidworld time? Is she from the modern day, the era when Baum wrote the Oz books? Does time even flow at the same rates between the worlds.

Also, in my mind, the first thing that suggested to me that Charlie was from Stupidworld was way back in the first book when Charlie understood Parson's leet speek in the eyebooks but Sizemore did not.
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