Dancing Cthulhu wrote:I'm a bit rusty on rules, where do we learn just loosing a capital is enough for all that to happen?
If the ruler dies without an heir we know all their cities "freeze" and units in the field disband. If a heir is in the field when they loose their cities/ruler they go barbarian, and any units not in their stack disband and treasury is limited to their own purse. If a garrison is captured all units for that side in that city are captured... but I don't think just losing the capital is enough to wipe armies in the field and turn all their cities neutral.
Ever since dwagon fall Jetstone had been playing as if there was a very good chance Spacerock, the capital, was going to be lost. Trem was planning on evacuating Slately and then either attacking the GK forces or retreating with all the Jetstone forces in Spacerock. But Trem wasn't heir and there was no talk of changing the capital before hand - if just loosing a capital turns all cities for that side "neutral" and disbands non-heirs/rulers then Trem and the entire army with him would have been doomed the moment they left and GK claimed the garrison, and he certainly wasn't acting like he was making a choice between losing an army to Wanda or losing an army to disbanding. Changing capitals only popped up fairly late in the game at Charlie's instigation.
Plus (might be wrong here) Faq lost its capital, but don't they still have more units then could possibly have been in King Banhammer's stack alone? (Jillian was safe as heir)
I think it's plausible that Faq's evacuation consisted of a single stack, especially given that they chose to stash some casters in the Magic Kingdom where they would be inaccessible until Faq had a capital again. It could be that those casters were stashed in the Magic Kingdom so that they could earn their own upkeep, or it could be that they didn't fit in the stack.
Regarding Jetstone, you make a good point that they didn't think of switching capitals on their own. It might be that the Jetstone Ruler would have had the opportunity to re-assign the capital to Jetstone city automatically if Spacerock fell, or it could be that (as some believe) a Side doesn't fall until it loses all of its cities. It seems likely that there is a rule that can cause a Side to fall even if the Ruler is still alive, because Stanley was planning to "start a new Side" at the ruins of Faq when he fled from GK. I doubt a Capital Side (as that is what non-tribes are called) can exist without a capital, but there is no clear evidence of that.
Either way, that Jetstone would have fallen because of losing Spacerock no longer seems likely to me, so we need a new counter-argument to joosy's suggestion that Jetstone should have handed over Spacerock to GK instead of delivering Clonely to the throneroom.
It is quite plausible that Charlie wanted an inferno, and the Jetstone strike force helped make that happen. He could be hoping it will kill Parson; he could be anticipating using his own archons and/or a weakened Haggar to attack Spacerock and thus wants its defenses destroyed; he could be hoping to prevent GK from razing it for cash. In any case, it's not clear if Sylvia would have lit up the garrison if Jetstone didn't invade it. Pressuring Sylvia into creating an uncontrollable firestorm while at the same time evacuating all Jetstone troops from the garrison probably didn't seem to be compatible goals. Plus, Charlie is happy to see Jetstone resources be consumed.
From Jetstone's perspective, handing Spacerock over to GK without the strike force would have required something very unpalatable. Since Cubbins was incapacitated, he couldn't be ordered to evacuate or surrender or make a suicidal attack. He was also inaccessible; Ace found him and rescued him, but they didn't know that he would succeed. Moreover, Trammenis may have disagreed with Ace about which caster was more valuable to them, and if Ace hadn't gone over Trammenis's head, Trammenis might have preferred to keep Ace and give up on Cubbins. With Cubbins incapacitated and inaccessible, the only way to control the timing of handing Spacerock over to GK would have been to disband him. That would have been a bitter pill to swallow.
zyxophoj wrote:As escaped Jetstone prisoners, Parson and Antium move on Jetstone's turn - good enough to get out of the city, watch it burn down, get back in again, and reclaim the city. Still, units have to evade a trap to get out of an inferno so they'll be losing even more units. Ouch. This does allow more than nothing to survive but it's looking pretty grim. I'm starting to like those plans which involve getting Sizemore in to put the fire out a lot better.
A nit-pick: they wouldn't be able to reclaim the city because there would be no city to reclaim. There would only be a city site, and it wouldn't even have anything to forage for upkeep. Good luck keeping the red dwagons fed.